HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council Minutes 11/19/20011
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November 19, 2001
City of Petaluma, California
Minutes of a Regular
City Council Meeting
Monday, :November 19, 2001
Vol. 37, Page 1
ROLL CALL: 3:25 p.m.
PRESENT: ,.:O'Brien, Healy, Torliatt, Vice. Mayor Cader-Thompson;
Mayor Thompson, Maguire
ABSENT: Moynihan
PUBLIC COMMENT
Vince Landof,;,12 Cordela Drive, said that the. garbage problem ,behind Albertson's
on Petaluma Boulevard .North arid' Payran Street is still as bad as ever. The
garbage is attracting; vermin.
Mayor Thompson will discuss the issue.with the City Manager.
Diane Reilly Torres; Rainier Avenue„announced that she had found a dead rat in
her fishpond..Regarding requests .for information from the City, she gave the City
Clerk a written. copy of her concerns., for the record. They are as follows:
1 have explained to Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson that on or about March
19; 20Q1, Councilmember .Bryant Moynihan asked to have the Rainier
project:put on the agenda. He handed to the Mayor and Councilmembers
a memo he had drafted. At that meeting three times it was brought up
Moynihan has a conflicf of interest regarding the Rainier Project.
I contacted the City .Clerk and asked fora. copy and .was told they were not
given one. I also asked for a copy of what Councilrnember Healy handed
out on or aboutApril 2, 2001 at a Council Meeting re: Letter to CalTrans to
add Rainier to Novato Narrows Project. The City Clerk did not have a copy
of .that, either. After calling numerous ,times,, .this was faxed to rne. Katie
Crump told me to call Mike Healy, which l did, and he faxed me 'what he
had distributed.
Over the next two months l broughf to the Council's attention SCTA
minutes, Novato Narrows Minutes, Countywide Transportation Plan,
MTC's, RTP, etc:, involving Ramier`and Moynihan.
On June 4, 2001, 1 attended the Council Meeting and asked if Moynihan
was going to pull this out and try to pass a resolution. The Mayor said he
Vol. 37, Page 2 November 1'9, 2001
1 PUBLIC COMMENT; continued
2 _
3 .did not know .what l was talking about., Councilmember Torliatt asked for a
4 copy of this memo. l gave my original to City Clerk Claire Cooper.
5
6 l left ,the. meeting and watched on `T. V A notion was made tp ,adjqurn the
7 meeting and Moynihan pulled out a paper and said,, "Diane Reilly Torres
8 prodded us with this. ,It' looks like something I drafted back in February or
9 March; but it's not my version." While sitting as a. Councilmember for the
10 City of Petaluma, Bryant Moynihan publicly and personally attacked rne.
11 He insinuated' thaf l provided the City Council with a falsified document.
12 This was unfree and he attacked my credibility and slandered~me,.
14 . Affer the June. 4, ZQ01 Council Meeting l did a Public Records Request.
15 and this piece of paper was included: It was the :only- paper that, did not
16 have a. City stam, p ,and date: I finally spoke #o Katie Crump. She said she
1`7 had typed it, l asked her why. She'-said.Councilmember Moynihan asked
18 her to: l asked' for the communication requesting .this. She told me she .
;.
19 threw it away: l told her what he said on June 4, tha_ t this was not axis
20 version. Katie, acted surprised and told me she would look around forit.. '1
21 never, heard back:
~. -
23 I want the mem, o Moynihan handed ouf on ltilarch ~19; 2001. Moynihan
24 says this is not,it. 1 also want the City to cure the action of a Petaluma City
25 Councilmember personally attacking me by basicallytelling th,e 'eritire City
'26 1 am a liar.
27 _. ,
28 Diane Reilly Torres
29
30
3:1
32 COUNCIL.COMMENT.
33
34 Councilmember Msguire;
35
36 Referred to the League of California Cities' newsletter's commentary on the Loeaf
37 Revenue Accountability Act and Vehicle License Fee _Backfiill, The Local
38 Revenue Accountability Act seeks to preserve sources of local income by
39 requiring a 2/3-majority vote. of state legi'slature.. to reallocate funds: :State
40 legislators promised to maintain, he Vehicle License Fee- Baei<fill when, the tax
41 was reduced. Cites, rriust. eneourago Assembly ;Membe'rs and Senators not- to
42 Vote for a budget that contains a local government-funding take -away. He asked
43 Mayor Thompson and City Manager Fred Stouder to draft letters to that effect:
44
4'S
46
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 3
1
2 COUNCIL COMMENT, continued
3
4 Councilmember Healy:
5
6 • Concurred with Councilmember Maguire and thought this was the, "first step in a
7 long battle."
8 • Regarding Diane Reilly Torres' issues, he asked City Attorney Rich Rudnansky to
9 call Ms. Reilly Torres regarding her concerns. `
10
11 City Attorney Rich Rudnansky replied that he didn't know what Ms.. Reilly Torres
12 was talking about regarding a memo from Councilmember Moynihan.
13
14 Councilmember Torliatt: '
15
16 • Directed IVIr. Rudnansky to call Ms. Reilly Torres and ask her what her concerns
17 are. . .
18 • Chief of Police Pat Parks was unable to attend this .evening as .his .father is
19 seriously ill. Item 11, Review of the City's Traffic Safety Response System, has
20 been removed from the agenda.
21 • Received an a-.mail from Tree Advisory Committee Member Gabe Kearny
22 announcing that he has moved to Novato. She asked the.. City Clerk's Office: to
23 begin the process of advertising for a replacement. She thanked Gabe for his
24 hard work on the committee.
25 • Received notes from several citizens regarding sewer rates. She wanted o be
26 sure citizens realize that each bill covers atwo-month period. Tle City is working
27 toward ause-based fee system. She encouraged .those with concerns~about rates
28 to participate in Council Meetings.
29
30 Councilmember O'Brien:
31
32 • Was contacted several months ago by a group of citizens who would like to install
33 a bench in memory of Pat Dougherty,. owner/operator of CalWest Rentals on
34 Petaluma Boulevard, in Shollenberger Park. The bench would be installed and
35 maintained at no cost to the City.
36
37 Mayor Thompson will contact the Parks and Recreation Department regarding the
38 bench.
39
40 Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson:
41
42 • Asked that the policy for installing such benches be placed on the next
43 Recreation, Music and Parks Commission agenda.
44 Would like copies of letters to/from the County regarding the wastewater facility.
45
46
Vol. 37, Page 4
Na~ember 19,.2001
1 COUNCIL. COMMENT, continued
2
3 .Will be installed next. month as: President of the North Bay Chapter of the League
4 of California .C.ities and would like-to take with her letters from Council regarding
5 the issues to which Councifinember Maguire referred.
6 1lVished everyone a .Happy Thanksgiving:
7 -
8
9 APPROVAL'OF MINUTES October 15, 2001, Novem-ber 5, 2001
10
11 The minutes of October 15, 2001 were.. approved ,as amended:. Page 1 Line 30:
12 should read, "....would like to have this agendized ,on the Consent Calendar:" P-age
13 4, .line 27~, '"the City included in calculations for the. fees." Page 8, line 28, "entitle"
14 should be ``title.." Page 25, Line 27, ``...phofovolta"ic systems woula-.be ^ff~ put
15 in for the ~ 10 % of the homebuydrs whose lots have the correct oriertation in order
16 for them to~ function;: and provide the option for the balance.'' Page, 27, line `37; #1.
fi7 "T,en percent of the homebuyers,. whose. lots have the correct orientation in, order for
18 the systems to furi'cfion; would have photovoltaic systems put in." .Line 43, add'. the
1.9 condition `'to ir-Stall a .Roundabout at the intersection of Corona Road and Sonoma
20 Mountain Parkway:"
21
22 The minutes ~of November 5, 2001 were approved as amended: Page 7: Vice Mayor
23 Caller=Thompson voted "no."
24
25
26 CONSfNT'CALENDAR
27 _
28 The following .items were .enacted 'in one motion made by Vice Mayor Caller-
29 Thompson and seconded by Councilmember Maguire:
30
31 AYES: O'Br.ien, Healy, Torliatt; Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson,
32 - Mayor Thompson; Maguire
33 NOES: None
34 ABSENT': Moynihan
35
36
37 RESO.2001:-1.94 N~.CS..
38 APPROVI(VG CLAIMS AND BILLS
39
40 Resolution 2001-194 N:C:S. Approving Claims and Bills.
41
42
43 RESO.2001-195' N.C.S.
44 DISPATCH CENTER.STANDARD WORKSTATIONS
45
46 Resolution 2001-1.95 N;C.S. Authorizing the Purchase of Dispatch Cenfer
47 Standard Worksfafions From Xybix Systems in the Amount of $44,355.87..
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 5
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CONSENT CALENDAR, continued
STATUS REPORT
PAYRAN FLOOD MAN'AGEMEN$ PROJECT
Status .Report Regarding Payran Flood Management Project Financing and Budget.
PROPOSED AGENDA
Approval of Proposed Agenda for Council:'s Regular Meeting of December 3,
2001.
Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson moved,, seconded by Councilmember Torliatt, to
approve the proposed Agenda for December 3.
***End Consent Calendar***
RECRUITMENT/SELECTION OF CITY CLERK
Discussion and Possible Direction/Action Regarding Recruitment and Selection
of Future City Clerk, Including:
A. Recruitment Internally or Through Reeruitmerit Firm.
B. City Mariager7City°Cle'rk Model (Santa Rosa, Rohnert Park)
C. City Clerk Job Description
D. City Clerk Reporting to "City Council or City Manager.
E. Preparation and Distribution of Council Packets.
Mayor Thompson stated he was, "leaning toward the Santa Rosa, Rohnert Park
way of dealing with the City Clerk.'' He does not think it appropriate for the City
Clerk to have Department Head status and pay, as the County now handles
elections.
Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson pointed out that :the City Clerk must. still deal with
many extra tasks during an election year.
Councilmember Healy noted that the City Charter calls for the City having a City
Clerk and a City Manager. He asked City Attorney Rich Rudnansky if there was any
reason why one person couldn't be both.
Mr. Rudnansky did not think so.
Vol. 37, Page 6
November 19, 2001
1 RECRUITMENTiSELECTIOIV OF CITY CLERK, continued
2
3 Council:member Maguire: asked if the City Clerk' could report'to the City Manager, or
4 would that:require an amendment to the City Charter?
5
6 Mr. Rudnansky`thought an :amendment might be required.
7
8 Councilrnember Torliatt reminded the Council of the extensive discussion~they had
9 about the: City Clerk's job description last year. She values ahe City Clerk's position
10 as .Public 'Information Officer, and as keeper of the City's records, which she
11 described: as, `'a daunting task." She believes the City Clerk should act as
i2 Webrnaster for the" City's Inte_rnef presence. She also thinks the Clerk, should report
13 directly to Council as this provides an important system of "checks and balances:"
14
15 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson supported Couneilmember Torliatt 's comments... She
1.6. would. like to review the responsibilities of the -.City Clerk and consider,' areas of
1"7 ~ revision that. would make people more comfortable, :but she does not want.'the City
18 Manager to be the City Clerk. She would prefer to improve the City Clerk's job
19 description.
20
21 Counclmember Maguire .noted that Council had tried to craft a job description that:.
22 would work well. He had .expressed dissatisfaction at the time, and time had shown
:23 that they had not been successful. There were conflicts. about overlapping daties.
'24 He believed .the problem was twofold: Council ,did not separate duties clearly
25 enough, and the person holding the position was, `drying to move. beyond what the:
26 intent of #he, position- was." He believes that. the .Public Information. Officer is an
27 important position:,-and agrees that having the Clerk report directly to Council would
28 provide a system. of checks and balances. Records management:is critical, and thee
29 City Clerk needs. to be ,familiar with laws. regarding .records., He would like `to take.
30 the most recent job description, which was included in the October 15; 2001 Council,
31 packet, and ;make some "wordsmthing" changes to reduce confusion about, "who
32 .does. ,what:." He does not see 'the :City Clerk's position as being as important. as the
33 City Manager's... He added that be sees the agenda and packet process as a City
34 .Manager's Office function'.
35 .
36 Councilmenber Healy agreed w. ith Mayor Thompson that the City should move
37 toward the Santa Rosa/Rohnert Park model: He heard people Talking about
38 "systems of .checks and balances," and he said that "was the last th7ng [he] wanted
39 to see." He wanted to see "a smoothly ir-tegrated organization that' functions. as a
40 team:" He noted that the "tun` battles" and "competing power centers""between, the
41 City Clerk, and the City Manager's Office .led. to, "a predictable outcorrme,~" He agreed
42 with the need to have a public information presence and a web presence:, and he.
43 thought the way to do that was to have a Depufy City Clerk reporting to the City
44 Clerk/City Manager: He did not ;see: this as an opportunity to downsize the City
45 C,lerk's Office., but as an opportunity to improve the function of the office.,: and not
46 have `The Council: "mieromanaging"lssues. The current situation he described as
47
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 7
1 RECRUITMENT/SELECTION OF CITY CLERK, continued
2
3 "not healthy." He added that the City of Santa Rosa operated very smoothly with
4 former City Manager Ken Blackman also acting as City Clerk.
5
6 Councilmember O'Brien also liked the Santa Rosa/Rohnert Park model, and
7 thought it would free up the Clerk's Office to handle other things. He did not see the
8 Clerk's Office. as the appropriate department to handle the City's web site, since it
9 was "after all, just a matter of scanning stuff in." He added that he is "computer
10 illiterate." He remarked Ghat Council was receiving .meefing minutes in a lot timelier
11 manner than previously. The City could save money by' eliminating one department
12 head. .
13
14 -°Councilmember Maguire asked if the City Manager were also the City Clerk, would
15 the existing City Clexk job description apply to the Deputy City Clerk? If so, that job
16 description would need to be .revised.
17
...
18 Councilmember Healy agreed that a job description would. be needed for the City
19 Clerk. or the :City Clerk/C'ity Manager.
20 -
21 Councilmember Maguire noted that the current job description contains, "ambiguous
2~2 language thafleads to organizational roadblocks."
23 ~ '
24 Councilmember Healy suggested that instead of, "designating who is responsible
25-.for what," Council should focus on what they want to see done. The City
26 Manager/City Clerk would then designate a person o"r team to accomplish that.
`27
28 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson was not convinced that it would be appropriate.. for
29 Petaluma to go with a City Manager/City Clerk model, as Petaluma is very different
30 than Santa Rosa. She would .like to talk to staff in Santa Rosa and Rohnert Park
31 about how the situation works for them.
32
33 Councilmember Healy pointed' out that at this point; Council was not talking about
34 amending the City Charter. If' the City Manager%City Clerk .idea did not work out, the
35 City could revert tb the old model.
36
37 Councilmember Maguire remembered that Council had asked to have as much of
38 the `packet" material as possible put on line, but added that he wasn't saying that.
39 job belonged to one department or another.
40
41 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson .pointed out. that because the agenda changes so
42 much, she .sometimes. received an agenda item. two or three times. She thought the
43 idea was fo cut down on ,paper use. If items were available,on-line, it would be a lot
44 more efficient.
45
46
Vol. 37, Page 8
November 19, 2001
1 RECRUITMENT/,SELECTION OF CITY CLERK, continued
2
3 Mayor Thompson agreed that this was the direction in which. the City should be
4 going. .
5
6 Councilmember .Maguire thinks the. City Manager is right ao say that he. wants to
7 read. and approve things :before they are released to the public, whether it's in paper
8 form or on the computer. He has dome a good,job of making sure staff reports are
9 accurate.. This requires time and resources. .
10 `
11 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson thought.. that a lot; gfi the City Clerk's. job had been
12 :moved over to City Manager's office already. Katie Crump is already overworked..
13 How would .making the City Manageralso the City-Clerk help: this situation? I`nstead`
14 of moving, `it to. the Manager's Office, she asked if there 'was a way to :r..e~ise the
15 Clerk's position to make it work .more easily.
16
17 Councilmem, ber Maguire :clarified that what was .being proposed was a., ``change in
18 lines of authority." If the existing City Clerk job :description were: applied to the
19 Deputy City Clerk; who: reported to the City 'Manager ('as City Clerk);. the duties
20 would not change.. What would be eliminated would be, "the conflict of authority and
2.1 turf wars. " _
Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson .asked who would. be responsible for keeping the
City's records in That scenario.
Councilrnember. Maguire replied that the Deputy City Clerk would.
28 Mayor Thompson suggested that he draft ,descriptions for the City .Manages/Cit
29 Clerk and Deputy City Clerk and bring it back to Council at -the DecembeC 17t
30 meeting.
32 Councilmember Torliaft,said she didn't understand how changing the position would.
33 better sere. the public, which she thought should be the focu_ s. She agreed that
34 teamwork was very important. The former City Clerk had put together a job
35 description that was, for the first. tune, very clear. The.,City Clerk's responsibilities
36 are important and nurnesous. The City Clerk needs to be a separate;, department.
37 head. position and paid 'accordingly. She thoiagfit it important. for Council to be able
38 to give direction directly to the Cfy Clerk. Personality conflicts and power struggles
39 need to be resolved. Authority .resting with one person will not beneff public, ,
40
41 Mayor Thompson- disagreed, as the system. would be .mole efficient: He described
42 the currenf structure as, "anfiquated and cumbersome."
43
44 Couneilmember Healy wanted to ask the City Manager to provide a draft of: his view
45' of the organizational structure, `if he were toy act as City Manager/City Clerk.
46
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page.9
1 RECRUITMEIVTLSELECTION :O;F'CITY CLERIC, continued
2
3 Mayor Thompson agreed.
4 '
5 Councilmember Maguire agreed and also wanted Council to discuss how other
6 cities work with that organizational structure.. Regarding recruitment, .council could.
7 not make a decision until they had clarified the position(s) arid job description(s).
8
9 Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson agreed with. Councilmember Torliatt, saying that the
10 purpose of the organization is~ to serve the pubiie. She hears conflicting things from
11 the public about various departments' responses: to their ,requests for information..
12
13 Councilmember Maguire noted that he' hears from one citizen more than any other.
15 _ PUBLIC COMMENT
16
17 Diane Reilly Torres, Rainier Avenue, responding to Councilmember Maguire, stated
18 she is, "not the only one complaining." :She feels that when former Assistant. City
1.9 Manager Gene Beatty".retired,. "things started falling .apart:" Now Executive Assistant
20 Katie Crump 'had taken over some of the things that Mr. Beatty did. Ms. Reilly,
21 Torres explained 'that; she needs information .for .her television program, and is
22 unable to ge_t it, ;as it,~is, '"not"where~it'ssuppgsed to be before the meetings."She
23 added that she knows pother members~of the public are angry as well at their inability
24 to :get information..S.he thinks the public should be able to get. every staff report. via
25 e-mail.
26
27 Mayor Thompson replied' that its was a Council goal to make the staff reports
28 available on-line:
29
30
31
32 ~ ORD. 21.24 NCS (INTRODUCTION)
33 REDWOOD EMPIRE SPORTS ASSOCIATION (RESA)
34
35 Discussion, :Direction and Possible Action Regarding Introduction of Ordinance
36 Approving Lease With Redwood, Empire. Sports Association (RESA).
37 (Continued from October 1 Meeting)
38 ~ .
39 Director of, ;Parks and Recreation Jim Carr explained that thee: -city .does not have
40 sufficient. funds ~ ~to build and' .maintain its own parks, ,but 'th'is project .provides
41 construction. and maintenance. The. City wall :realize a percentage. of the gross
42 revenues. He described it as,, "a good deal for community:," He .noted that the City
43 Attorney had provided Council with redlined copies of the lease and subordination
44 agreement.
45
46
Vol. 37, Page 10
November 19; 200.1
1 ORD. 2124 ,NCS (INT.,RODUCTIOIV)
2 REDWOO'D'EIVIPIRE,S'PO:RTS ASSO'CIATIO'N (RESi4),_confnued
3.
4 Counclmember Torliatt .asked if th`e. Recreation, Music and. Parks Commiss_ ion had
5 reviewed: the lease: agreement and pro: forma:
6
7 Mr. Carr replied that they had reviewed the lease agreement, 'but not the pro forma.
8
9 Councilmernber Torliatt`. thought that fi hey hadn't seen thee: pro forma, they weren't
10 informed.. abqut the costs involved.
11
12 M`r. Carr', agreed:.
13
14 Councilmember Torliatt asked if'the City's. risk management attorney had reviewed
15 the documents,.
`16
17 Mr. Garr re,plie.d that he had not. ,
18
19 Councilmember Torliatt thought that, if would:' be prudent before Council gave, their.
20 approval.. '
21
22 Mr. Carr aske'd' Councilmember Torliatt the .purpose; of, that review,, as the: language
23 in the documents came from Risk Manager Mike Acorne.
24
,.
25 Counclmember Torliatt would like 'the: entire agreement reviewed in. regard fo
26 liability to-the City, as well as insurance coverage. She noted she had put forward .a
27 list 'of ue
q stions. at the: last meeting at; which the item was :discussed.. She .received
28 answers, but wasn't`sure she agreed with them. '
29
30 Finance .Director. Bill Thomas- explained that; Ron Blanque will assume the City's
31 Risk Management tasks as of December 1, when Mike Acorne retires: Mr. Blanquie.
32 Has looked. at the documents, as has the Risk Management Consortium:
33
34 Councilmember Maguire. asked f'thewater level 'in the well. dropped. before the City
35 was prepared to deliver°tertiary water would City water be provided?
36
37 Mr. Carr replied that the City has tw.o top-notch we is within .400 yards. of the site: He
38 added that the way the agreement reads, the City provides water.:
39
40 Counclmember Maguire thought the .language, regarding that; should, be::clarifed:,
41 Should limits be specified?' 'He also wondered if` minimum days and hours; :of
42 'operation, other than, specific times for City soccer Jeagues; would bespecified.
43
44. Mr: Carr.confirrned that,: minimum days and hours of operation would ,b'e specified as
4'S a Condition of Approval.
4'6
November 19, 2001
Vol. 37, Page 11
1 ORD. 21;24 NC.S (INTRODUCTION)
2 RED,WOOD.~EMPIRE SPO'RTSASSOCIATI;O'N (REST, continued
3
4 Community Development Director ,Mike Moore noted that the Conditional Use
5 Permit specifies hours of operation as 9:00 a.m. - 11:00 p.m., 7 days per week.
6 That does not necessarily mean there will _be games going on until 11:00 p.m. The
7 field lights will shut down when a game is over anal the rest-of the time will be for
8 people to leave the area;
9
10 Council'member Maguire asked if 'it was irnportant`to the other Councilmembers to
11 know whom the partners were in the venture.
12
13 Councilrnember Torliatt and Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson ,both. said They would like
14 to know. .,
15
16 Councilmernber Torliatt added that she would like to "know who would be
17 guaranteeing this' Jease.
18
1.9 Couneilmember 'Maguire. thought a Council subcommittee should be formed and
20 that Councilmember Torliatt should ;be a part of it He, noted #hat the City has said
21 that in the event the well drew down the neighbor's wells, the ,City would provide
22 water to them strictly #or domestic :.use: ~ .
23
24 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson.. read from page 3, section 1'0 of the staff report that
25 "the, "city would have ,the- right #o cure. any default."She asked. if that .meant the City
26 would have the first ri'ghY to do so:
2T
28 City Attorney Rudnansky agreed.
29
30 Vice ..Mayor Gader-Thompson would prefer that any requests for signs. or notices
31 come before SPARC instead of :Council.:. She is concerned about signs :because of
32 the rural setting. She asked fhe other Counclmembers if they agreed that such
33 requests should come before SPARC.
34
35' Council agreed:
36
37 Councilmember Healy thought that changes made to the draft document were
38 improvements. He was, "Still haying .heartburn over the subordination issue." He
39 understood that there had been some improvements there, and that it was limited to
40 the construction loan, and that,. the subordination agreement isn't given unless
41 there's a take-out commitment for permanent ;financing, and there are now
42 guarantors who are ,guaranteeing RESA's performance during, the construction
43 period. He' thought that a cumbersome way of .doing it. He asked why the
44 :guarantors wouldn'.t, just guarantee RESA's performance. directly to the construction
45 lender and leave the City out of the loop with.. respect to the. fee interesf in the
46 property. Was there some technical :reason why that- has to work that way?
Vol,, 37, Page 12 Novernber 19„ 2001
ORD,, 21`24 IVCS
=mNiHE SPORTS ASS.O.CIATIO'IV (RESA), confinueal
Mr. Rudnansky explained that the .original ,language carne from' the real estate
,attorney who had` been retained by the `City..., He d'd not change that. He did think
g
abaranteesnthat aredattache uarantee in favor of .the .lender in addition to the.
g d to the .cease that ,are in favor of the City. That could.
always include that at the discretion of the City;
Mayor Thompson, agreed.
Healy if the guarantee 'is worth as :much as it purports to be, the guarantee should..
go directly fo the lender, and; then we don't have the subordination'issue at all.
Maguire thought subordination clauses were required to snake-fhe loan.
17 Rich the only -think- L ,could think,of is if there was a default. on the lease and the bank
18 moved forward to foreclose,-they .could .still foreclose., and then 'they would have the
19 right to go after the guarantors ,Here the way 'it was strucfured. is that the City would
20 .step in, cure the .default, and .then we could go after the .guarantors directly. The
E.
2;1 bank would riot be ,in the picture;, their loan would be paid,; they'wo.uld not-forec,l.ose,.
22 sand we'd have .the ;right to go after the guarantors ;for the money. That's- probably.
23 why they structured it;that way.
Councilmernber Healy, agreed that if .would work,, '"as long as tMe guarantors ,are
good for fit. ~ He thought if important that the guarantors have as ..much standing
behind, them as the' amount of the construction roan:
Councilmember Magui"re thought Councilmember Torliatt and 'Vice Mayor Caller--
Thompson should gef information abouf that.
Counei_Imembe.r Healy didn't need. to. have Cou.nc'il review the pra forrnas;. the
financial's of the guarantors. He though City. staff. could make cure. the guarantors
have the assets to back the guarantee. they're making.
G.ouncilmember :O'Brien noted that Mr. Hronec brought up a, ,good` point .at the,
Planning Commission meeting when he said he would' be shutting the lights off as
soon as possible after a game., because they are expensive to operate. He 'has that
:incentive.
Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson asked how .City staff could evaluate ,a pe'rson's ,ability
fo,r a .guarantee.
44 City Attorney Rudnansky explained; that language had been added that ,guarantors
45 needed to be acceptable. and approved by the ,'C'ity Manager. If he was not satisfied;
46 he would be able'to request -more .information..
November 19, 2001
Vol. 37, Page 13
1 OFID. 21,24 ;NCS:;(IIVT.RODUCT/ON)
2 REDWOOD ENIPIRE~SPORTS ASSOCIATfOIV (RESA) continued
3
4 PUBLIC COMMENT
5
6 Juan Colorado,, address not given, explained that' his property about 200 feet from
7 the proposed complex:., He said his family has not: been notified about, "a lot of
8 things thatare going on and we feel like we're being left out."They had talked to the
9 Planning Commission abouttheir concerns,, but did not_know if the Commission had
10 passed those concerns on fo Council, He stated that his facnily~wastold a soundwall
11 wou'ld' b,e: built - not a cyclone:#ence with wooden slats. Right now they get a lot of
12 noise from the: golf course:: Me' knows the :City needs parks: Initially, he understood
.;
13 that this project would' benefit the City, and wanted. to part of it, but because his,
14 family's concerns have not been .heard', "Now we are kind of against it."His property
15 value has declined.: His family would like the sewer connection in place before the
.
16 project goes up. They would` like. to see everything the City's has promised, "in
17 writing."He added that he, "does ,not want to feel that there are `bacK room things'
18 going on"
19 ~ ..
.
20 Councilmember Maguire thanked, Mr. Colorado and asked Mr. Moore why he wasn't
21 notified.
22
23 Mr. Moore replied that, Mr.. Colorado was notifiied of two .h'e'arings of the Planning
24 Commission. He 'has .not missed anything in terms of Conditions of Approval. The
2S issue of the water .connection is ,addressed 'in the Jease. The other issues are all
26 relevant to the use permit, about~which tte Planning Commission has not yet made
27 a decision. - ~ ~ '
28
29 Counclmember Maguire asked. if when the Planning Commission makes a decision,
30 that would come before Council.
31
32 Mr. Moore replied, -that it would', knot. He added that the lease that was in fact. drafted.
33 a number of years ago, sand some 'revisions have been made. The issues relative to
34 the use permif are very specific: He did, not think they needed to be part of the lease
3.5 discussion.
36
37 Councilrnember Maguire answered that for the future,, he thinks Council would like.
38 to get: that kind of information. Regarding things the Planning. Commissions will
39 , make decisions on, .he basked if those would be part of the use permit..
40 ,_
41 Mr. Moore replied that ,it would depend on what~deci'sions the Planning Commission
42 made.
43
44 Mayor Thompson, asked when' the Planning Commission was scheduled to meef on
45 the issue.
46
Vol: 37, Page,14 Novem6e~'1':9, 200.1
1 ORD. 2124;'NCS~ ;(IIVT,RODUCTION)
2 REDWOOD EMPIRE SP:ORTS~AS:SOCIATIO:IV (RESA); continued
3: PUBLIC' COMMENT; continued
4
5 Mr: Moore answered that it was not yet scheduled: 'The Commission is waiting to
6 see what Council decides; about they Pease.
Mayor Thompsgn assured Mr: Colorado that le~woul,d be ,notified.
Marty Hronec,. applicant,,, ,noted than, he and his partners had tw,o discussions with
the Colorado facnily~ regarding the 'traffic issues. H'e thought they had reached an
agreem"ent regarding the type offence ~to be_ installed`, arid.. extra frees to be planted
and maintained on the Colorado property at no cost., to the family. `In, case of an
unusually large tournament, RESA, would send Mrs: Colorado to a hotel for the
weekend: He added, that the design. of the site will focus' noise to the west and away
from nearby residents. There'will a double `t'urning lane; on East 1Nashington,
Mayor'~Thompson thanked Mr~ Hronec:
Couneilmember Healy asked, if wafer would go 'out to the ,Colorado property based
- - .. .
on a draw down test,: arid: if so, how quickly could that bey done? 1Nould it have to
wait until the sports complex .was actually in operation?
Mr. Moore a reed'; and`said that the .draw down test could be completed ~as soon as
9 -
..... "
the .irrigation level was dug.
Councilmembe.r Healy saw no problem... with providing :domestic water to .nearby
properties:
Councilmemk'er Torliattwondered how doing a dr"aw down test row could determine
what the water situation might be in, fhe fufu"re.
Mr. Moore replied. that well experts with Sonoma County have: stated that drawdown,
tests are Very indicative of what .will happen in. future: If' there: is ;an immediate
impact; dorestic water will b.e provid:ed.
Coun. cilmember Torliatt asked. if all area;;~wells would, be pumping at the same time
when the tesf was conducted. - .
Mr.: Moore pointed out that the .City wells have been 'i'n place for a number of years
and do not impact-'the Colorado well:
.< .
Co.uncilmember Torliatt thought they wells in the area should b'e pumping during the
d`rawdown fest:. The. kroader issue was that. she City was saying it~ could provide
.__
domestc water -for peop e. outside the Urban `Growth Boundary (;UGB). ,I# those:
residents"-wells run dry, they can no longer use their property for agriculture'.
November 19, 2001. Vol. 37, Page 15~
1 ORD.. 2124 NCS (INTRODUCTION)
2 REDWO.O'D EMPIRE' SPORTS ASSOCIATION (RESA), continued
3
4 Council was trying to support agricultural use .along the UGB to promote non-
5 expansion of the UGB. She noted that;.. "the -whole process has gone on for so long
6 and seems.so disorganized. The lease,, eoriditional use. pecrnit are all over the map:"
7 She didn't understand why this information wasn'f being puf .together for the
!' 8 community. Mr. Colorado had to' get .information for tonight's meeting dropped off to
9 him on Saturday night..
10
11 Councilmember Mealy noted. that' as soon as 'tertiary treated wastewater is
12 available, the- well will .revert to City use. Me thought this particular project had
13 suffered; from an excess of process:; he is happy with the work to-date.
14
15 Councilmember Maguire agreed with Councilmember Healy. He asked Mr. Moore if
16 a drawdown test was, expensive or difficult.
17
18 Mr. Moore replied that it was not.
19
" 20 Councilmember Maguire suggested a drawdown tesf be conducted yearly until the
21 City provides tertiary' treated, water. He :didn't. think it made sense to think you are
22 going to predict five years into future with a drawdown test.
23
24 Mayor Thompson asked Mr. Moore to find out from the County about yearly
25 drawdown tests.
• 26
27 Councilmember Maguire thought, regarding how much RESA will be allowed to
28 pump out of the well,. thataperhaps itmight be wise to set a limit.
29
30 Councilmember Torliatt referred to the answers `to her questions of the previous
31 meeting regarding" financial reporting. Regarding, "Rent Payable, Section 38,"she
32 would like to. know what percentage of revenue the"City would, receive.
_ 33
34 Regarding the section about 'who pays. for tertiary water, she thought the answer
` 35 was too vague. On .page 8, the City needed the :option. to keep the well'.. open.
36 Regarding question number 21,, the Recreation,. Music, and Parks Commission will
37 make a recommendation to ,Council. It will not just be dealt with at the department
,~ 38 level. S.he did not receive exhibits D, E or F, Regarding the question on first right of
39 refusal;. she would like to the City notified_of any percentage: greafer than 20%.
40
41 Mr. Rudnansky asked, Councilmember Torliatt. if she was referring to .assignment.
42 This has to do with a bona fide offer:
43
44 Councilmember Torliatt, clarified, 'if someone was going to purchase- 20% of the
45 complex, was the Cify .going to be notified? She added. That slie sympathized with
46 the Colorados regarding living next door to a complex open until "11 p.m.
Vol. 37, Page 16 Noyem6er 1:9,.2001
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
'16
`17
18
19
2Q
21
22.
23
24
25
26
2,7
28
29
3,0
3:1
32
33
34
35
36
37
3'8
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
ORD. 2124 NCS (1111TRODUCT/ON)
REDWOOD EMPIRE..SPORTS ASSOCI
continued
Councilmember Maguire, regarding the City's percentage of revenues.; referred to
page 3, line 103,,, and exceptions to what is counted as. gross; revenues: He; would
want concession sales included in gross revenues;
Mr: ,Cars pointed out that in line. 1'04:, concession sales were included in gross
revenues.
Councilmember Healy made a mofion to.ntroduce Q,rdinance'21'24'NCS, with four
modifications:
_.
1. Annual drawdown tests if required by City staff until tertiary water is.avaifable.
2. Review of financial information by Council aubcornmittee:
3'. Guaranfors; have financial wherewithal equal to the amount of the construction
.loan..
4. Option for Cityfo take ove'rthe well.
Councilmernber Torliatt :asked to ..add having Ron Blanquie review the: documents.,
Mr. Rudnansky pointed out that Mr. Blanquie is not an attorney.
Mr. 'Thgmas~ added that the City belongs to a joint powers authority #or risk
managernent~ and he believed they had reviewed it. '
Counclmember.Maguire seconded CouncilmemberHealy's motion...
AYES: O'Brien, Healy,, Vice ,Mayor Caller-Thompson, .-
. _ Mayor Thompson; Maguire
NOES: Torliatt - '
ABSENT: Moynihan
Mr. ,Rudnari ky announced that s'nce~ the vote was not unanimous, the City. would
be required by law to publish. "the ordinance in the newspaper, He asked 'if Council
would agree ;to publication of a summary of the agreements in the newspapers with
the fialLteXt available for review in the .City Clerk's Office.
Co.uncilmember Maguire moved, seconded by O'Brien, to publish a summary of
the agreements.
AYES:: O'Bn°en, Healy, Torliatt, Vice Mayor Cad~er=Thompson,
Mayor'Thompson Maguire
NOES:: None
ABSENT: Moynihan.
November 19, 2001
****,**.
1 Mr. Carr announced that a 24-pound catfish was caught in Lucchesi Pond four
2 hours ago. ,
3
4 Gounci[member Healy exclaimed,. "So, that's where the ducks have been. going!"
5
6
7 ,ADJOURN TO CLOSED SESSION
8
9 Council adjourned to Closed Session at 5:26 p,`m. on-the~following matters:
10
11 ® PUBLIC EMPLOYEE PERFORMANCE EVALU'i4TION, Government Gode Section
12 54952: Title: City, Manager.
13 ® CONFERENCE WITH LABOR NEGOTIAT,QR, Government.. Code Section 54957..6 -
14 Agency fVegoator: Cty,Attorney. Unrepresented Employee: City Manager
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28 PRESENT:
29
30 A~.SENT
31
32
33
34
35 At the request of 'Vice
36. Allegiance.
37
38
39
EVENING SESSION
Vol. 37, Page 17
RECONVENE 7:00 p.m.
ROtL CALL.
O'.Bri:en, Healy, Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson;
Torlatt, Maguire, Moynihan
Mayor Thompson
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
Mayor Caller-Thompson, John King led, the Pledge of
.MOMENT OF SILENCE
40 At the request of Vice M, ayor'C.ader-Thompson, a moment of silence was observed.
41
42
43 REPORT OUT O:F CLOSED SESSION
44
45 Vice .Mayor Caller-Thompson announced thaf no reportable action was taken during
46 Closed Session.
47'
Vol. 37, Page 18 November 19, 200.1
1 PUBLIC COMMENT
2
3 ..Bill Donahue, 28 Oai<wood Drive, Chair of the .Residents Action Committee at.
4 Sandalwootl ,Mobile Home 'Bark, had spoken .before Council at, the October 1G5tn
5 meeting. Residents at the park are facing dramatic rate increase's and; possible,
6 litigation.. He has attendetl meetings at other parks- .where residents are; being
7 confronted'with major cf'anges to what.they th_ought'were permanent arrangement"s:
8 Acti;o=ns of park owners ,could be summarized in three words: "rent,: rent, rent:." Rark
9 owners are requesting, major rent increases throughout the~~state. The main ~attaek is
10 ion the portion of the City ordinance dealing with.,: "vacancy:control."Vacancy control
1:1 is thee, "life ,blood" of mobile home rent- stabilization. Mr., Donahue asked. Cou"ncil's
12 help in protecting vacancy control, by covering: some or all of, the costs involved. He
13 asked if Council ,had received a memo .from the City Attorney explaining .the City's.
14. understanding, of the rent ~stabili'zation ordinance. He was to have received a copy
.15 by November.~5, and has not yet received it_..
City Afforney Rich Rudnansky explained ;that he had 'just. completed the rnerno: He.
:arranged for Mr. Donahue to pick up :copies from :th'e' City Attorney's Office: on'
V1/ednesday, !November2:1.
21 ,I<alista Matthias, 1308 Lindberg Lane;. spoke. regarding; ``law-abiding citizens being
22 held prisoner by aw breakers." Her. neighborhood. has problems with speeders;;
23 vicious animals.,, drug.dealing, .and attacks on property. She stated ,that the Police:
24 .Depart'ment has aid these things., ``do not require Police attention; they are the
25 residen s' responsbUify through the Neighborhood WatchProgram.."Her family and
26 other families. on Lindberg Lane have become;; "prisoners.'' She :asked that :the laws
27 , on 'the books. be enforced; b.ecause,,, '"Protecting. citizenry of Petaluma, should be af.
28 prime .importance:"'
Uce Mayor ~Cader-Thompson .referred to other neighborhoods; where .Ne,ighborhood
Watch meetings are held on a monthly basis and officers covering that beat attend
the .meetings. She. asked Ms, .Matthias for her phone number;. ;and. said., she, would
ask Police.Chief Pat Parks to.:contact her. She thanked herfor.coming~forward.
~~Carl Mead,. 1~3~08 Lindberg .Lane, echoed ~Ms.:M'atthias's~ comrimenfs, and added "that
the Petaluma Police Department is too ~srrmall for''the size of":the `population",
Vice Mayor Caller=Thompson told Mr. Mead she shared' his concerns. She asked.
:him to send. a letter to Council. '...Neighborhood' 1Natch is a good place to start
Mr. Mead asked how to go _about~ getting speed bumps and stop signs installed.
Vice ,Mayor Caller-Thompson explained .that Council; looki_ng'~at these. as part of the
General, Plan. She asked Mr, Mead to include those issues in his letter..
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 19
1 PUBLIC COIVIIVIEiVT, continued
2
3 John FitzGerald, Petaluma River Festival Association Board of Directors. The first
4 festival was held in 1986 and eleven more were held, ending in 1997. The festival
5 returned a Tot of money to -the turning ..basin and. City. He gave Council a package of
6 the special light bulbs for the pedestrian bridge; and asked that. they be put in place
7 for the Christmas Season. He thanked the present and past Councils for their
s support.
9
10 Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson thanked Mr, FifzGerald for his participation in the
11 community.
12
13 Len Carlson, 349 Circulo San Blas, Rohnert Park, President of Rohnert Park Mobile
14 Homeowners,. spoke about park., owners using scare tactics to coerce residents into
15 signing. long leases.. He explained that the formula that determines if owners can
16 increase rents is based on how much the owner has invested in the .park, not on the
17 purchase price of the park. He thought the City should make residents aware of the
18 City and State laws. that regulate Phis. He thinks owners 'are entitled to a fair rate of
19 return on their investment, b.ut questioned how 'to determine-what that rate would
20 be, when "there is no competition."
21
22 Robert Fleak, 157 Parque Recrero, Rohnert Park, represents the, Golden State
23 Mobile Home Owners League, and is president of his park. He gave Council a
24 handout showing rates of return of various industries, including mobile. home park
25 ownership. The .owner of his park takes '.home about $:1 million -per .year:. Some,'.
26 residents are having to choose between rent,. food, and medications. He asked what
27 other industry was guaranteed a profit each year through state law. "What more do
28 they want?"
29
30 Paul McGavin, 297 . Cambridge Lane, Petalumans '.Against Nuisance Traf#ic
31 (PANTS)... PANTS now has 150 members, representing an• urea of..1,000 homes.
32 The group had asked to be placed on the agenda on. October. 15tH. On October~30tn
33 he had afollow-up meeting with City Management, at which he was encouraged t_o
34 "slow down and allow this to go along :with the General Plan. process.." He thought.
35 the City should have the same respect for the current General Plan. He~showed an
36 overhead of what the current General Plan says about truckers, i.e., routing',trucks
37 (Chapter 10). He showed another overhead of current, truck resfrictions. By not
38 putting restrictions in other areas, he believes the City is• guaranteeing there will be
39 inappropriate truck traffic through residential areas. He would like to add truck
40 routes to the Generaf Plan process.
41
42
43
COUNCIL. COMIVIEN7'
44 Councilmember Healy :announced. that COTS will host a party for its volunteers on
45 November 29, from 5:00 - 7`.00 p.m. at tfie Petaluma Kitchen, Payran and `D'
Vol. 37, Page 20
November 19, .2001
1 COUNCIL COMMENT, continued
2
3 Streets: He asked anyone who has volunteered at the kitchen or COTS to call. Lisa
4 a`t 765-653Q and RSVP for the party.
5
6 Councilmernber Moynihan was sorry the Traffic Committee discussion was delayed
7 yet again. He attended a U.C. Berkeley .Real :Estate :Symposium in :San: Francisco
8 today. He noted 'that .nationally; 439.,000 jobs were lost in: October. Petaluma.. needs
9 to reduce expenditures and -use funds to repair streets. "Some days you are a
10 pigeon, some days you are a statue."
11
12 Couneilmember O'Brien 'adopte'd a puppy named Clancy and a kitten .named. R.J:
1.3 from the Animal Shelter. On 'December 1, from 9.:30 a.m. - ,1.:30 p.m., the City;
14 Sonoma County 1Nater Agency, and the North Bay Watershed:, will be working on
15 restoring Thompson Creek; between Westridge Drive and .Sunnyslope Road rain or
16 shine. Anyone: who wants to help plant frees and shrubs is welcome. `In response to
17 Couneilrn'ember Mo,yrihan's "doom and gloom statement about the economy;" he
18 encouraged e~e.ryone to take. a .minute on Thursday to remember what he~ or "she
19 has to be thankful for, anal wished everyone a Happy Thanksgiving.
20
21 Councilrnember Torliatt attended the 9/11 Art Show yesterday. More thane. 200
22 ,people attended this event; which supports local artists.. She encouraged everyone
23 to shop locally:
24
25Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson 'agreed. She thanked all those who .have come to
26 ~ "speak to Cqunei,l about: the mobile home rent: issue.. She assured them the matter
27 would be paaced on the agenda, probably not-until affer the.first of the year.
28 ..
29
30 AGENDA.'CHANGES, ADDITIONS, AIVD DELETLONS
31 _ _ __
32 Item t'1, Review` of City's:Tra fic Response System, was removed. as Chief Parks.
33 was'unable'to.attend tonight''s_meeting.
,. ; _
36 ORD 2125° NCS -
37 ZERO:,NET FILL
38 '
39 PUBLIC HE4~R1NG
40
41 Adoption of .an Interim' .Urgency Ordinance 2125 NCS .Pursuant to Government
42 Code Section 6.58.58 Extending 'for a Period of One Year Interim Ordinance No,
._
43 2017 Prohibiting U es That May be 'in Conflict UVith a Contemplated :Amendment to
44 the Zoning Ordinance ("Zero Net Fill").
46 Community Development pir~eetor Mike Moore. requested extension; of the: urgency
47 ordinance: for no .net fill regulations for another year, as allowed.. by law.... If it is not
.November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 21
1 ORD 2125 NCS
2 ZERO NET' FILL, continued
3
4 extended, it will expire on December 1; 2001, and no net fill regulations will revert to
5 those that exist ins the City's zoning ordinance..
6
7 In October staff' came '.to .Council with issues regarding how the interim ordinance
8 was being applied.... It originally covered a .limited ,area, but. now covers all of the
9 floodplain-combining district. It threatens the: Dowritown River Apartments project
10 and development in the Central Petaluma Specific ,Plan area. It is possible that
11 certain.. properties within the Specific Plan area may not have. any development
12 potential based on regulations of the zero net fill ordinance.
13
14 Staff has identified four alternatives for Council. The purpose of the interim
15 ordinance is to give the City time to put together a permanent ordinance:
16
17 ® Extend the interim. ordinance as, it currently .exists -covering all floodplain-
18 combining properties in City.
19 ® Modify the- ordinance so that. no-net fill requirements apply north of the
20 Payran Street Bridge to the. City limits. This would still expand the no-net fill
21 area.
22 ® Extend the ordinance for another ,year but provide. an exception for City
23 sponsored affordable housing projects.
24 No action: ;inte,rm ordinance would expire December 1, .2001, and the City
25 would revert to~~no-net,fill regulations in Chapter 16 of the zoning ordinance.
26
27 Mr. Moore, continued~~ that staff believes th'e: best course of .action. would be to extend
28 the interim ordinance for another year; but modify the restrictions to north of the
29 Payran .Street Bridge within City imits.~This is an; urgency item and would require a
30 unanimous. vote of Those present toa make the ordinance effective immediately. He
31 pointed.,-out alternative wordings;
32 ,-
33 Vice Mayor- ,Caller-Thompson had -spoken to Mr. Moore after the last meeting
34 because. he was not happy with vofng on the matter because she wasn't really
35 clear on it. She thought Alternative `B' would make it possible to move fortivard with
36 the Downfown.Specific Plan.
37
38 Councilmember Moynihanthought Vice .Mayor Caller-Thompson was referring to
39 Alternative `A' -:not `B.'
40 t
41 Mr. Moore:clarified~that `B'~'would extend the :ordinance and change.the-boundaries:
42
43 Councilmember Torliatt would like to hear from City Housing Administrator Bonne
44 Gaebler' or John FitzGerald of FitzGerald and Associates if they saw any impacts on
45 the Eden Housing project.
46
Vol. 37, Page 22 November 19, 2001
1 ORD;21''25 NCS
2 ZERO NET'FILL, continued
3
4 Ms: Gaebler explained that the Eden project. would: confinue through the approval
5 process; because tine .Community De~elopme.nt ,Departm.ent .staff has deterrnned~
6 that this project' meets the criteria of the existing .zero net fill ordinance.
7 .
8 Counc'ilrnember Torliatt asked if there were any ..other concerns. 'Water can be ~4"
9 deep `in the' parking lot. d'uring~~ f00-year flood event;.,
10
`11 Ms. G'aebler' was concerned with other projects 'in Central Petaluma Specific Plan.
12 The 4"'water question will come to Council separately.
13
14 Couneilmember Torliatt, asked how much of the Central. Petaluma Specific Plan is`,in
15 the floodpJain.
16 .
17 Mr: Moore replied, that;30-40% of the CPSP i`s in the floodplain.
18
19 Councilmember Healy asked Mr: Moore if staff had looked into off-site mitigation for
20 zero net`fill.
2,1 .
`22 Mr: Moore explained that he City does not have the ability to .ideptify potential sites
23 and would have to-rely on someone really knows hydrology. ~ -•
'24
'25 Counc member Healy asked; regarding the Eden project, if Mr. Moore was saying
26 that the project would remain, the same. whether zero net~fill was in effect or riot:
27
28 Mr. Moore confirmed this. The current projecf meets zero net ;fill regulations:.
29 ..
30 Councilrnember Healy asked the'. rationale' for drawing the -line at the Rayran Street
31 Bridge. 1Nere. there .any scientific or technical reasons?
32
33 Mr: Moore explained that the bridge was the original boundary line. The. original
34 intent was;to protect that neighborhood:
35 .
36 Councilmember Healy pointed out that adding fill in the floo.dplain meant .displacing
37 -water onfo other properties: He did not .think the: City should distinguish; between
38 different places in floodplain, .nor does he th.ini<-staff has exhausted the possibilities
39 -for making zero net fill work in the downfown, area.
40 _.
41 Mr. Moore said he didn't disagree. They did not. anticipate this issue, w,h_ich, was the
42 result of the analysis Eden h:as gone through to comply with zero,nef fill ~1Nith the
43 information they have: so far, staff can only speculate on the potential. impacts: This
44 needs to•be part ofahe Generaf Plan.
45
46 :Counclmember Maguire. asked if there. we._re a rough estimate of the .or..dex of
47 magnitude the additional hydrology study would take:
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 23
1 ORD 2125 IVCS
2 ZERO IVET FILL, continued
3
4 Mr. Moore ..replied that there was not.
5
6 Councilmember Torliatt understood that construction above the flood control project
7 would diminish the effectiveness of the projecf.
8
9 Mr. Hargis explained that the Corps project had ,minor negative downstream impact.
10 Offsite .detention has been discussed for continued development. Zero net fill could
11 also be considered; Some developers have accomplished zero net fill compliance.
12
13 Councilmember Maguire asked Mr. Hargis if he recalled the hydrological capacity
14 downstream of the Washington Street Bridge.
15
16 Mr. Hargis responded that Washington Street :had a 100-year carrying capacity prior
17 to the project. The Corps looked at the fact. that water overflows into the downtown
18 area, in the vacant lots that front onto 1ashington Street between the bridge and
19 Dairyman's Feed.
20
21 Councilmember Torliatt repeated that she thought. if building continued upstream of
. 22 'the Corps project, the :risk of flooding downtown increased. She asked if there had
23 been any progress at the County level on zero net fill.
24
25 Mr. Hargis .replied that staff worked with the_ Zone 2A Citizens Advisory Committee.
26 He, believes the City has to lead by example by creating policies within the City and
. 27 then go to the County and assist with getting- similar things adopted for the entire
28 watershed.
29
30 Councilmember Healy asked again how would Eden, change its project if it were not
31 constraihed by zero net fill.
32
33 Jeff 'B`enneft, Developer Director; Eden, explained that they would like to raise the
34 garage floor.
35
36 Councilmember Healy asked if they would change:. the- elevations of the storefronts.
. 37 The staff report implies that zero net fill. should not be applied to the project because
38 -there .will be a four-foot elevation difference in the sidewalk and the stores. He didn't
39 think that sounded like it was the result of the zero net fill -just common sense
40 building in a fJoodplain.
41
42 Mr..Moore: noted that zero net fill requires two #eet elevation above finished floor
43 elevation.
44
45 Councilmember Healy continued. that under FEN1A regulations., the floors could
46 three feet up instead of four. He thought the zero net fill ordinance was needed to
Vol. 37, Page 24 November 19, 2001
1
2 ORD 2125 NCS.
3' -ZERO NET FILL, continued
4
5 protect the downtown area. It` sh-ould not: ,just be focused on the. Payran
6 neighborhood.
7
8 Councilmember Moynihan. shared. Couneilmemb'er Healy's concern with consistent
9 appaication of the zero net fill ordinance:.He asked what.. level. of protection, the
10 downtown area had befo,"re the Corps project.
11
12 Mr. Hargis replied that immediately downstream. of the Payran St'reef Bridge was'so
13 narrowed,. (here-was only a :fou r or five=year leve ofproteetion.
14
15 Co.uncilrnernber Moynihan understood that the Corps designed their projecf fo take
16 if ;up through a 100.-year level with. the General Plan build out. If development
17 continued further, it.would be reduced to a forty-year.level..
18
19 Mr. Hargis said that was correct. The area of protection is focused on the Linda D:el
20 Mar area.
21
22 Council'member Moynihan thought the City would. have the benefit, of the Payran
23 Flood "mitigation project regardless of whether there was a zero net. fill ,policy °in ~ -
24 effect: When the project was complete, he wondered if the zero .net fill policy would
;25 be necessary. $-
26
27 Mr. Hargis replied that if the City spent: $32 million. to get a 100-year level of
28 protection, he thought that should be protected. ,
29
30 Councilmember Moynihan asked. for confirmation that the goal of the project .was ,,.
31 eventually to have aforty=year level of protection. ,
32 -.
33 Mr. Hargis/Councilmen-ber Maguire responded thaf the design was fora 1g0-year ~-'
34 level of protection..
35 "~
36 Mr. Hargis went on to explain that zero net fill is a displacement issue: If the City
37 adopts `FEMA regulations;, it makes an assumption that. if is not going to raise.-the
38 ..level of the river by ,one foot. The zero net fill concept is designed to prevent that;
39 one-foot increase #rom .happening. Detention ponds, etc:, are ~to prevent increasing
40 run-off: The Navigant study looked at locations. for detention ponds: where they .
41 could be placed where they do the. most. good,; without. doing any harm. Most of the
42 feasible site-s, were in the County area. If was important fo dete.rmirie ;thaf detention.
43 ponds were not being placed where fheywould add to a `peak.''Barrng this,. "smart,''
44 ponds should be .built.
45
46 Counclmember Moynihan asked Mr. Hargis if he, .as. City Engineer;, would
47 recommend abandoning the;:zero net°fill policy when the flood project was complete.
November 19, 2001
1
2
3
Vol. 37, Page 25
ORD 2,125 NCS
ZERO NET FILL, continued
4 Mr. Hargis reminded Council that his recommendation about a year ago was to
5 enforce zero net fill north of the Payran Street Bridge.
6
7 Councilmember Maguire asked if he was' correct in thinking that the Corps project
8 was designed to mitigate impacts in the Payran area., .but would result. in a slight
9 negative increase 'in flooding risk in the downtown area. He also wondered what
10 building techniques people' would use to build on .land, dowrtown if there was no
11 zero net fill.
12
13 Mr. Hargis asked Councilmember Maguire if he had noticed the old houses on
14 'Washington Street just east of the river. They are' quite elevated.
15
16 Councilmember Maguire replied that "That was then,.. this is now." People would. still
17 try to find ways to build on their property. He asked if properties would be buildible
18 without zero net fill.
19
20 Mr. Moore. agreed that this was the ``big" que Pion. Staff does not have a definitive
21 answer. 1Nith the Eden project; they have been able to .identify some potential
22 issues that may or'may not be: applicable to other properties in the area.
23
24 Councilmember Maguire thought that even if the City didn't continue with zero net
25 fill in the CPSP area, the CPSP would need fo address the same issues.
26 ,
27 Mr. Moore pointed out `that the FE_MA regulations would remain; and he .did, not;
28 know that they had. caused any problems.
29
30 Councilmember- Maguire asked if fill were broughf in; would the displaced water
31 impact doownstream or upstream.
32
~.
33 Mr. Hargis. answered -that probably both upstream and downstream would be
34 affected.
35
36 Couricilrriember Maguire asked, if staf# had :any .,idea. h;ow Gong it. would take to do a
37 hydrological study for building guidelines for CPSP.
38 .
39 Mr. Moore replied that they did riot. What they werereally trying to do is get
40 direction on which policy has precedence:
41
42 Councilmember Moynihan -asked if Alternative `A' was Alternative language '2:'
43
44 Mr. Moore replied that it was, and Alternative `B' was Alternative language `1 .'
45
46 Councilmember Moynihan. was concerned that. not applying the zero net fill
47 ordinance uniformly would put the City at risk for liability.
Vol. 37, Page 26 Novernbe_r 1.9;.2001
1 ORD 2125'NCS
2 ZERO IVET FILL, continued
3
4 City Attorney Rich Rudnansky said that hadn't been discussed in particular.
5
6 Councilmember Torliatt noted that "the City owns apiece of property on which the
7 sports complex would be built. She wondered :if a detention pond could be: added on
8 that site: -
9 .
10 Councilmember Torliatt noted. thaf the Executive Director, of the. Bay Area Air Qualify
11 Management District (BAA"QMD) has indicated that: they may be requiring, cities to
12 provide. detention ponds.
13
14 Gouncilmember Healy believed the City owned additional land behind the RESA
1:5 site.
16
17 PUBLIC: COMMENT
18
19 Wayne Miller; Lieb & Miller, offered a slightly different perspective. He does not
20 "think zero net fill is conceptually wrong,. but.: believes the.,problern is how it is being
21 applied: If it is applied, on'a parcel-by-pa_reel basis, it will exclude some development
22 the City wishes to hate in the CPSP area.; It needs to be applied. on an area-wide
23 basis,, He suggested the City look at the CPSP as proposed, and :find locations for
24 :depressions that could serve as detention ponds for the entire area. They can also
25 be more than "holes,n the.ground,"They'can be parks and greenbelts..
26
27 Councilmember Torliatt thought Mr.,~ Miller' was "absolutely righf on: the mark." :She:,
28~ wond'eretl if it would be possible to have detention "ponds..under the. parking
29 garages.
30
31 Councilrnember. Healy :noted 'that J.T. Wiek had coined the phrase "car aquarium"
32 for a reason'.. He believes off=site mitigatonw,ould be appropriafe in "the downtown
33 area. At the last meeting he. mentioned one mitigation site.,, the McNear peninsula,
.~
34 ~ and what the City hopes fo achieve there as far as restoring' the habitat. That will
35 require removing a fair amount of fill. Council has one.'last yearto restore some kintl.
36 of an ordinance. The 'inferim ortlnance helps preserve the: atatus quo ;in the
37 rneantirne. It' was adopfed unanimously `last December, extended unanimously in;
38 January. With minor changes, it can. be extended for another year. He asked, `if
39 Council.. wanted, to drop the two-feet requirement to the :one_foot. required by FEMA:
40
41 r M
P y
42 see what w II ha th en~ or do the Wlo th ou hdthe same ~ tmn wait another year to
PI? Y 9 ° _. _ _ 9,. _ "gy. astics'' Eden .h"as had
43 to go through. Perh-aps fh"e sglution ,is to pull back the zero riet f_LI area to the. Payran
44 Street Bridge, still protecting residential areas but allowing some flexibility f,or
45' downtown:
46
47
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, .Page 2Z
1 ORD 2T25 IVCS
2 :ZERO fVET:FI'LL, continued
3
4 Councilmember Maguire said.: that the need for the CPSP is great. It :needs to go
5 ahead sooner rather than later. If it were .necessary to extend this ordinance, he
6 would want fo know what the: cost a_ nd time would be for a hydrological study and
7 what building techniques would probably be used.. Detention ponds have -some
8 merit but it is not easy to make them work right. The question is flow fo proceed in. a
9 responsible manner to move the CPSP` forwards, and still protect the City from
10 flooding. He thinks the McNear peninsula. has some potential Fiis quandary is he
11 doesn't know how long it would take to go out and "look at hills and depressions"
12 and figure outwhat to do. He is' inclined fo go with Alternative `B' which will preserve
13 the bulk of the zero net fill ordinance but wilt not impede `the CPSP. He asked Mr.
14 Moores if any special building techniques will be ce:quired, regardless of zero net fill.
15
16 Mr. Moore rep ied that because downtown has not been subject to zero net fill,
17 builders have been able to bring in #ill, and that would continue.
18
19 Councilmember Healy .mentioned. that the.. Golden. Eagle Shopping Center- was an
20 example of a development that. uses fill. ~ " .
21 .. - _ `
22 Councilmember -Maguire noted thaf building on stilts. is possible, b_ut it increases
23 costs dramatically:
2'4
25 Mr. Moore explained that the Water Resources Element of the General Plan will
26 lead to direction to change City building regulations. -
27
28 Councilmember Maguire,. did not think. the City could afford to wait five years to
29 move ahead on the Central Petaluma Specific Plan
30
31 Councilmember Healy was concerned that if'there were no zero net fill regulations
32 in force downtown, new development would include big earthen berms.
33
34 Councilmember Torliatt did not think the coming year would impact the City much.
35
36 Councilmember Moynihan made a motion to adopt the interim ordinance with
37 Alternative Language 2.
38
39 Councilmember Healy seconded the motion..,. but asked if there were any
40 modifications suggested.
41
42 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson dial not. think. there would be more "Golden Eagle
43 Shopping Centers'' downtown.. She believes good design can make the difference..
44 She added that one year. is important, and the City will be able to move forward with
45 the economic developrnenf of downtown. She. was not willing to continue stalling the
46 CPSP. Any development would still have to be approved by the Planning
47 Commission and Council.
Vol. 37, Page.28 November 19, 2001
1- O:RD 2;125 NCS
'2; ZERO fVET FILL, continued
3
4 Councilmembec Torliatt asked the status of the GPSP. She thought Council might
5 not see if unfil May or June of next year,
6
7 Mr. Moore, explained: that the ELR must be completed. The scoping sessions are
8 almost finished. ,S,ome updating will be necessary. The public hearings will take.
9 ,place in February,or March.
10
11 Couneilmember Torliatt; .concluded that adoption of the plan would: happen mid-
I2 2002. Council has been hearing about it and working on it for years. She did. not
13 think the timeline of the zero 'netfill ordinance would :have a big impact here.
14
15 Councilmember Maguire believed ffaf if the interim ordinance: was in effect for .one
16 more..year, 'it would force developers to achieve a higher standard of design. He told.
17 'Vice. Mayor Caller-Thompson. thaf he understood her not wanting to vote for this,,,
18 but he felt thaf he had to vote for it:
19
20 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson said that: ``something lust ,doesn't feet righf about fhis
21 whole process;" but she wasn't sure: what it was.
22
23 Councilrnember Maguire responded that the next agenda, item might answer Vice
24 Mayor Caller-Thocnpson's concerns: Zero Net- Increase.
25
26 Vice. Mayor Caller.-Thompson asked :for confirmation that. unanimous yes vote was
27 required for the ordinance to be extended..
28 _
29 Mr. Rudnansky ,confirmed that a4/5fhs vote of the entire legislative body was
30 needed..
"31
32 Councilmember Healy explained that off=site detention . was a different issue than
33 what: Council; was really talking about tonight. Ne was talking about looking for off-
34 site mitigation areas with depressions within ~/a mil'e of the property.,
35.
36 Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson stated that if she :noted. ,against the ordinance:,
37 "basically, we end up with nothing. So I'm-kind of hamstrung. 1 really do~not support
38 how I'm going to be voting.."
'39
40 Terrence Garvey, 83 Maria Drive, suggested that the: simple solution would b'e for
41 the City to let everyone know who wants to buy or build downtown~that there will be
42 flooding. People wiLL build accordingly.
43 ,
44 Councilmember Moynihan moved, seconded by'Healy, to adopt fnterim Ordinance
45 21'25 NGS, with; Alternative Langu-age 2.
46
47
November 1'9, 2001 Vol, 37, Page 29
ORD 21:25 IVCS
ZERO: NET FILL, con~finued
AYES: ~O'.Brien, ;Healy, Torlaft; Vice Mayor Caller-Thompson,
:Maguire', Moyrihan
NOS.:: .None -
ABSENT: Mayor Thompson
ZERO IVET INCREASE
STORMWATER RUNOFF
Discussion and Possible Direction Regarding; Preparation of Interim Ordinance
Pursuant to Government Code Section 65858' Re'qui`ring Zero Net Increase in ..
Stormwater .Runoff From New Development`:.
Councilmember Healy noted that the General Plan pxocess is some time away from
completion. He is eery concerned about jpotential further degradation of the Corps
Flood project by new development. He thought' projects were having zero net runoff
requirements imposed on them in a rather "ad hoc,"manner: some projects had zero
net runoff requirements:, others didn't. He asked for staff's input.
Mr. Hargis said that as it stands, the ordinance is strictly a payment of fees.. Council
could require developers to .build detention ponds. However, the RMI/Navigant
study concluded that detention pond's by themselves could cause problems.. There
are no good. solutions to this. The General Plan is,really the best way to let this play
out.
Councilmember Maguire asked if the ordinance was still in place in order to collect
fees.
Mr. Hargis agreed; and added that t_fe other purpose was to require detention.
ponds.. .
Councilmember Maguire thought that while the. City was waiting for the General
.Plan to be .completed, _it sh'oul'tl be rigorous aboof collecting fees. He liked
Councilmember Torliaft's idea about putting. detention. pond`s under parking
garages..
Finance Director Bill Thomas remarked That staff would be studying, development
impact fee"s beginning at~the end of 'November:
Councilmember. Torliatt wanted to be' specific about watershed management
requirements, TMDL's, and storm drain'impact fees.
Councilmember Moynihan mentioned that the draft resolution included in the packet
usedthe phrase "normal'run-off."'He asked 'how one defernined "normal run-off."
Vol. 37, Page 30 November 19,,; 2001.
1 ZERO NET INCREASE
2 STO:RMWATER RUNOFF„continued
4 Mr: Hargissaid he~ had always inferpreted'it as the: change from .a porous surface:
5 that will allow some amount of water to percolate to ,a, hardscape..
6
7 Counclmember Moynihan reiterated, that the Navgant study suggested that
8 detention ponds could exacerbate flooding.
9
Mr. Hargis answered that 'the supposition was not a new one. He felt that,, "If you
make. °something ,better~most~ of the, time, i'f's probably a good thing. "
13 Councilmernber Moynihan. :thought the:key concern.was to' see improvement during
14 'times of saturation and inundation. Asphalts good becaus"e.it moves~.wate:r quickly:
1VIr. .Hargis explained that. there are places where detention doesn't. work. In .
:Burbank ,Housing, yo.u're befter off not detaining ,the water:.. There' a, danger ins
getting focused 'on portions of'.things 'instead ofi the whole picfure. Staff is trying #o
get out, of the engineer's ="tunnel viewpoint" and that's something the General Plan.
makes poss`ib1e.
Councilmernber Moynihan thought Council', hould wait until the hydrology report is
complete:.
29
Councilmernber..Magui're encouraged review of the: fee. structure and -collection of
fees..
No action, tak_ en:
CITY TRAFFIC. MODEL AND ALTERNATIVE :SC.ENARIO~S
Introduction and Discussion on Cify'Traffic Model and Alternafiue Scenarios.
_.
pirector of General Plan Administration Pamela Tuft. explained. that they had hoped
to :present the entire Traffic Model at.this time, but obstacles prevented: presentation
of a clean inventory of land. use. Staff' had to starf from cratch with a land use
survey.
Ms;. Tuftintroduced. Matthew Ridgway, ,Fehr, ;and Peers.,, consultants leading the
Traffic Element ,of they General: -Plan.. Mr. Ridgway '.thanked to Trae Cooper; :G1S
:.
Manager, and. Scott Duiven, General .Paan consultant,, for their contributions. He
then ,explained how Fehr:&, Reers will update.-the TRANPLAN;,based traffic model:
o Conversion. of the City' currerif model fi•om'TRANPLAN to Trans.CAD.,
® Update base year land uses database (;data provided by City,).
o Develop a GIS based' land use, network and zone system database.
November 19, 2001 Vol. 37, Page 31
1 CITY TRAFFIC MODEL AIVD ALTERiVATIVE SCENARIOS, continued
2
3 Develop density and diversity GIS sub"routines and incorporate these
4 attributes into the trip generation component of the model.
5 ® Calibrafe to current year.
6 ® Update :future year .,(2021) land use (land .use data to be provided by City
. 7 and/or' Dyett & Bh_atia-for each traffic analysis. zone) and traffic projections.
8 Ensure consistency and integration (fhrough data linkage) "with regional
9 models.
10 ® Prepare a model development/validation report.
11
12. Ms. Tuft had spoken with the County and they are..interested in pulling together the
13 City and County teams.
14
" 15 Councilmemb`er Torliatt asked Mr. Ridgway if his firm was involved with any other
16 city's general plans.
17 ~.
18 Mr. Ridgway, replied That it was not.
T9
20 Councilrnember Moynihan asked, fror";n rimaintenance and' updating standpoint, how
21. this model integrated with the County assessor's model.
22
23 ~Mr. Ridgway explained that it'will'integrate with anything that.has a GiS. If the City
24 keeps the land use data current, this model will. remain current..
25
26 Councilmember Healy wondered why every jurisdiction needed fo use a different
_ 27 model.
28
29 Mr. Ridgway replied that most cities will'.have an .independent model that is more
30 refined.
31
32 Ms. Tuft added that the GeneraL.Plan Executive Team unanimously agreed on the
33 TransCAD model because it was the only one that allowed multi-modal modeling.
34
3'S Mr. Ridgway explained 'that if the. Co;unfy can demonstrate that they have a reliable
36 model, Petaluma can link to it. However, their data is not currently reliable.
37
38 Vice Mayor Oader-Thompson found it very frustrating working on traffic when no
39 one was working "together." She didn't think it possible to coordinate with other
40 agencies if there were using different models.
41
42 Mr, .Ridgway mentioned thaf the County is in the process of fixing their ..model so it is
43 reliable.. When that is done:,. his firm will be happy to :link :Petaluma's modelto it. The
44 fundamental underpinnings of all modeling are the same.
45
46
Vol. 37, ...Page 32
November 1'9; 2001
CITY TRAFFIC' MODEL AND ALTERIVAT,IVE;;S.CEIVARIOS, continued
3 Couneilmember Torliatt .agreed with Vice, Mayor C_ader-Thompson that the idea of.
4 cities/counties working on same ,model was, great, as a number of cities :are in the
5 process of or have 'just. fin.'ished their 'General Plan. She sees the Transportation
6 Authorify ,as able to provide monies fo implement mode: choice in the model. She
7 asked Mr. Ridgway if this traffic "modeel would.,, be able to track firaffic accidents.-
8
9 Mr. Ridgway replied that the model itself .does not track accidents.. He didn't'know of
10 atraffic-forecasting model that did 'that. But the City has a very robust database ~of.
;11 accidents, and. they have imported that into TransCAD. They wilt be able to use this
1=2 to do a lot of statistical .analysis but. that is separate from ,traffic forecasting.
14 Councilmember Torliatt thought such data would be very valuable to public safety;;
15 She-.asked if the' traffic modeling considers .times of the year. S.he was interested in
16 knowing how' many trips are school related.
17
18 Mr: Ridgway answered that they can forecast based on tirne_ of year. The usua
19 analysis is based on a "Y~ypical situation." They' have .data gath.e;red over ;the
20 Christmas holidays last .year on existing traffic that: they could use. It might not be
21 good to try to design; a traffic plan based on traffic conditions that only occur a
22 couple of days per year,.
Councilmember Maguire asked how the model handled the phenomenon of
"induced traffic:" . .
27 'Mr: Ridgway replied that the .model would recognize latent. d'emantl. 'If. the model
28 .notes. that there are more people trying to use .a road. than the road can. handle; it
29 will take into consideration ~that~ some people. may opt not to. use the :road because.
30 they know how horrible the traffic'is. If lanes are added' to a roadway with pent up
31 demand, the model. will #oeecast an increase in traffic in that area.
Councilmernber O'Brien. thought the. model looked. great. 'He asked when the City
would' be able to actually`get some practical use out: of it.
Mr. D,uiuen responded that` because of the hold up of the land tise data, it wou d be
some ti'rne in January 2002 before a calibrated model was ready.
~Councilrnember O'Brien. asked if there were ariy plans to put. ,in data from other
cou_ my areas,
42 Mr. D.uiven eaationed that the model calibration process really shouldn't start until
43 all the data: has .been .input.,, If' Council wants fo include land use data from the
44. county, the calibration should waitfor that:
November 19, 2001
Vol. 37, Page 33
.CITY TRAFFIC MODEL AIVD ALTERNATIVE SCENARIOS, continued
2
3 Councilmember O'B,rien countered tha# change happens so continually that it would
4 be impossible ever. to have all the data.
5
6 Mr. Duiuen clarified. that a cut-off point in time had. to be, chosen: The data the
7 county has for areas surrounding ,l'etal,uma is-not nearly.'as reliable as..the data the
8 City has for within the City. -
9
10 Ms. Tufit spoke briefly fo Greg `Carr, of th`e,.Gounty Planning Department at 5:'1:5 p:m.
11 today and ~learned;~the .Co:unty i`s going to undertake n;ew land use data. If it's asix-
12 month project; the City will not wait. The City is not.-interested in delaying the Traffic
13 Model anothersix months. ~~
14
15 Councilme,mber Healy assumed "that once: the model was up and running and
16 calibrated, cif will be: used.:to look at different alternatives for improving traffic flow in
17 town. He asked how if would be-used to look of different potential projects.
18 - ~~
19 Mr. Duven: explained that it. would be done of Council direction or from concepts
20 emerging from the',pub.l'ic nputproeess..They, would use.a sort of "what-if"scenario:
2'1 "If we were going to serve traffic; what would we do to these roads?" Awhat-if
22 scenario..
23 - ~ _
24 Ms: Tuft wile .bring .:the-.input from the first. eight,. workshops to the December 17tH
25 Council Meeting. 'She will. be' bringing alternatives for public and Council review in
26 late spring or early summer 2002.
27
28 Councilmernber Moynihan asked if future land iase data or assumptions would be
29 needed 'to project future growth.
30
31 M:r. Ridgway agreed, and said that was .one of .the currently underutilized parts of
32 the database:.
33
34 Councilrnember Moynihan asked'if'that would be part- of'-the January model
35
,36 Ms. Tuft explained that they will be initiated #rom .the workshops and folded into the
37 data of the existing conditions and oppo'rtuniti'es report you will see in late spring.
38 The alternatives presented 'to .Council -will be a cgmpilation .and three or four
39 alternative scenarios.
40
41 Couneilmember Moynihan. stated that- Council has been interested in evaluating
42 various alternatives regarding across-.town. connector/interchange;., He didn°f think it
43 sounded like the information Council. would receive. in January would .be enough, to
44 :allow a decision. He asked when the cross--town .connector/highway interchange.
45 alternatives could be rnode'ed.
46
Vol. 37, Page. 34
November 19,,2001.
1 CITY TRAFFIC IViODEL AND ALTERNATIVE SCENARIOS, continued
2
3 Mr Ridgway answered that if the land use: data was available for that `in January,
4 the model could begin then. It wilt be probably two-weeks,.to one ,cnonth:~to prepare
5 the model.
6
7 Councilmember'Moynihan explained fhat in order.fbr the City to model across-town
8 connector and interchange and include it in the environmerifal clearance hase of
P.
9 the Narrows Project; it would have to 6e. ready for CalTrans '.by the end of
10 Decem`b:er. He,, wasn't sure what, the, direction from ~Couneil. would; be -perhaps,
11 that the Gity could not afford to wait for 'a model and should instead .provide them .
1:2 with a base :assumption:, fo keep:-our foot in the door, o to speak," and `'save this
T3 community'hundreds of'thousands of dollars:"
14 ~ ,
16 Tans ilmember Maguire thought 'that fad been rejected of the Sonoma .Co.unfy
portation Authority (SCTA).
17
1.8 Viee Mayor' Cader-Thompson.agreed. ~ '
19
...
20 Councilmember Moynihan. countered that Council .has the prerb:gat~i~e to go: directly
21 to CalTrans. He thought Councilmernber Healy ebuld' clarify that if there were 'some
22 questions about. what CalTrans is looking for to .continue to model correctly: They
23 are coope;rafing and if'"the .City can provide some clear direction as fo what; Council
24 wants. to do there 'is 'certainly opportunity to continue to use the p.ublc funds~'from
25' the~State:of California to:meet the transpo.rtation.;needs of ffiis'community.
'26 .
27 PUBLIC COMMENT
28
Rick Savel, 499 :Adobe Road, Perngroue was assuming that l,_ke the County; the
City's traffic. model was .going to be, based on 'future assumptions. He agreed that'
the :SCTA model was out of date, and' it was going to be updated. Ne understood
that it was a "finer-grain model;: than the MTC. model, which is a regional model. The
County is also considering doing an interim model, a "20=12" model They've
o ee o
m r the .oast twenty-three years- assu_m,ing .six, lanes on thee, freeway. The
lanes are still not there.,. but the p°opulafion .growth has occurred. What- is ne°eded_ is
a model based :on four lanes on the freeway except, for the two funded projects;
which' would'.be in the vicinity of Highway 12'. ~ '
39 John King, ,Penngrove, announced he: was,. "having: a flash.: A flash of panic."
40 Penngrove cannot cake any more (raffia. He. believes that if the City is using existing
41 County data, it doesn't have current traffic; data.
Paul McGavin, 297 Cambridge Lane,. representing PANTS (Petalumans Againsf:
Nuisance Traffic), stated that Council was,. "approving projects left and right; and'tf~e
traffic yodels for these are laughable:"Traffic models should, be calibrated "based
on people who live nearby.""He noted -that the. public's money was used to obtain
November 19, 2001
Vol. 37, Page 35
1 CITY TRAFFIGMO.DEL AND' ALTERNA~9VE SCENARIOS, continued
2 PUBLIC COMMENT; continued
3
4 the traffic counts. He asked when the public could; "actually get [their] hands on
5 those counts,"
6
7 Bill Paxton, 690 Skillman Lane., thinks the City and. County have to work together or
8 we will continue to be "an island here, the County fhere:" He encouraged what he
9 called a "Kuinbaya Meeting"with the County as soon.. as possible.
10
11 Vice Mayor Gader-Thompson thanked Mr. Donahue, and added that, "It takes citizen
12 participation fo make that kind of thing happen."
13
14 With regard to coordination of the City and County,, Ms. Tuft° explained that the
15 County receives all information on the General Plan process. 'She has attended
16 several meetings regarding the County General Plan.'The land use inventory of the
17 Petaluma greater County area was-:news to -her when she spoke to Greg. Carr at
18 5:15 p.m. today: She will set up a meeting as soon as possible of the two consulting
19 teams. She appreciates: all the City and County residents who have participated in
20 the General: PJan process. With regard to traffic counts; City management discussed
21 the availability of the raw traffic counts and; decided ;not to release that until the
22 calibration was completed. If Council feels differently, she will be glad to carry that
23 back to the management team.
24
25 Councilmember Torliatt noted that Council has discussed putting together a group .
26 of elected officials from the County, Cotati, Rohnert Park, and Petaluma. She thinks
27 now is the time to do that. She asked Ms. Tuft if Council should draft a letter to the
28 County asking that the two consulting teams meet.
29
30 Ms. Tuft .replied that direction from Council to the City Manager would allow her to
31 start orchestrating that.
32
33 Vice Mayor Gader-Thompson suggested that it could be agendized at the next
34 meeting of the Mayors' and Councilmembers Association.
35
36 Councilmember Healy asked when data would be available.
37
38 Ms. Tuft- answered that it would be .available in January.
39
40 Councilmember Healy said that January should be fine. He found it .interesting that
41 three of the four people who commented tonight live. outside City limits. He sees
42 communities wanting to add job creation and externalize their housing needs. He
43 wants to see Petaluma pursue creating housing to match jobs being created. "We
44 are doing a horrible job as a region in addressing these issues." He added that it's
45 hard for one City to do much about it.
46
Vol. 37, Page 36 .November 19, 2001
1 ,CITY TRAFFIC MODEL AIVD ALT.ERNATIVf' SCENARIOS; continued
2
3 C.ouncilmernber Torliatf noted that Petaluma can be proud that it has orie house: for
4 ~ewery„job.
5 _.
6 Vice Mayor Cader-Thompson, wished everyone a Happy Thanksgiving..
7
8 ADJQ,URN'
9
10 The meeting was adjourned at' 10:55 p.m.
11
12
13
14
15 ~ .%
16 ~_ ~ ~ _ J `'ce Cader-Thompson;. Vice Mayor
17
18 - - ... ,
19 ATTEST:
20
21 -'
22
23 Claire Cooper; tClerk Pr Tem
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25