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Home My WebLink AboutMinutes 08/24/1998August 24, 1998 Vo1.31„ Page 203 i MINUTES z OF A REGiJLAI~ ADJ®UItNED MEETING 3 PETALUMA CITY C®UNCII, a M®NI)AY, AUGUST 24, 1998 s It®LL CALL 7:00 p.m. 6 Present: Keller (DK), Torliatt (PT), Hamilton (JIB, Read (NR), Stompe (MS), Vice Mayor ~ Maguire (MM), Mayor Hilligoss (PH) a Absent: None 9 PLEDGE ®F ALLEGIANCE io Pledge of Allegiance to the flag was recited. i i M®MENT ®F SILENCE iz PUBLIC. COMMENT 13 Bruce. Hagen: The tape recording was begum after he began. to speak. "....much less is the earth's environment, by building a wall around it. So you people need to be able to enjoy is the countryside, so they may better learn to respect and protect it. And whether we aspire to i6 world peace,, or just a safe neighborhood, we must learn to work together in our own i~ community. Lafferty Park, with:its biological richness and inspiring big-picture panoramas, is can be Petaluma's place where. former antagonists come together and learn. Someday the 19 fighting over Lafferty Ranch will be history. We'll all be better off if we begin the ending zo today. If you would to support the activities I have described, you can call the Naturehood zi Watch at 793-2244, visit our website at www.cartsys.com/naturehoodwatch, or attend our zz kickoff meeting Wednesday, September 23rd,. 7:30 p.m. at Petaluma's Lucchesi Center, and I z3 extend this invitation to everyone on Sonoma Mountain and in Petaluma as well, and I hope za you'll come along with me. Thanks. zs Mayor Hilligoss: Thank you. Bryant Moynihan? z6 Bryant Moyniham: Good evening. ,Bryant Moynihan, 102 Dawn Place. And just a z~ friendly reminder, I guess we're in the second month of our fiscal year, and we'll still working zs without a budget, so I was hopeful that tonight we would speak,. be reviewing the budget, z9 and getting some questions answered, some of which I asked 2 months ago. I know it's a 30 long process, but it would be nice to address this important issue. Very concerned in the 3i long `term, about the fiscal health of out local city, and the previous or the preliminary 3z budgets we have reviewed are of great concern. I'm really concerned that what's happening 33 here is just a sliding and sliding and we're gonna. hit a meeting in the near future in which the 3a proposed budget will have to be adopted by this council for the lack of time. There won't be 3s any opportunity for public input from members of this public, or any others in the viewing 36 audience. And so I'd like to get some assurances from the council, indeed the complete 37 budget, including the CIP and the central Petaluma, excuse me, the PCDC would be available 3s to the public. for adequate review and input prior to the council taking any action on the 39 budget.: Thank you. Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS Councilmember Mary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MNl--vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 204, Vol: 32 August 24, 1998 i Councilwoman Torliatt: Madame Mayor? Could we ask: the city manager to get z the dates of when the budget hearings will'be? 3 Mr. Moynihan askedahls question a couple of weeks ago, and the date we said then is a still the date,. and that's the meeting of September 13th.. It's a special meeting and thee. first of s September or thereabouts is when the council, will have,, as we've said before, the complete 6 budget, including the PDC, and other community ~ groups will also have access to it. ~ Nothing's been changed. The answer is .still the same answer. s Councilwoman Torliatt: Madame Mayor? 9 I believe it's the second, it's the second Monday, so I believe it's the 13th. Someone io has a calendar present? u Councilwoman .Stompe: Madame, .Mayor, we're :also having a meeting on the iz .redevelopment: agency PCDC budget next Monday at'Lucchesi, I believe at 7'.00, so we are 13 addressing this incrementally: is The meeting next week is actually a review of the .history of the -PCDC, or the. is redevelopment agency and the two. redevelopment area expenditures for the last 14 years. or 16 so, so it's more of a review and accounting of the past, with some initial discussions regarding i~ revenue streams in the future. is Mayor Hilligoss: Guy Gullion? 19 Guy Glllion Dr. Guy Gullion,, 9 Eddie Court, Petaluma. The person that was just zo up here talking before me, Mr. Bryant Moynihan, is the person that ordered the 17-acre zi forest at.the foot of my hill chainsawed while'the' birds were still nesting.. Now, it would be zz easy for me to be.really angry with him. Because I see it every day. It looks like a,no man's z3 land. But other people in the: neighborhood have said, you know, divisiveness; doesn't help: za anybody. And we've already -heard people. talking. ;about -pending money- on legal. fees, zs spending energy on everybody's side. So what, we want to do, ;the folks in Cherry Valley and z6 Magnolia, sayto Mr. Moynihan. and anybody from the.McNear estates that we really do~want z~ to help you. all get. in so Ghat you' can develop some houses, so yoix can make some .money;. zs and we really do want at least an 8-acre park there,, that's.low impact. And it would be really z9 great if it wound up having a trail that connected it to the Petalurna River, grid there were 31 Thu sday at theg there. That's a vision of the future, and we're going to have;- meeting this P 'top of the cul-de-sac at 7 p.m. at Eddie Court fo discuss this. But it was 3z really thought that it was, crucial by everyone to try to go the neighborly route, instead of 3a getting divisive. That, I'm from a small town.in east. Texas, aril that's how you do things, .and 34 things work. better that way. .Although I must say, 'with all .respect, that in the Lafferty 3s situation, I saw some of~it from the very. start and I had to bow out for professional reasons. 36 When you..make overtures and they aren't met, you can only make so many overtures: until 37 .you decide, well, the swords. are. drawn and we just need to do ,b~~ttle as best.. we can. It's 3s really ad to have seen that happen'. here in this city, and I specifically, Madam Mayor, would. 39 say to you, there's been a number of discussions. ,And you're -busy"woman, you: could easily ao have forgotten to have presented that forest to the Open: Space District, and we don't want to , ai take personal harm. from tfiat, we don't want .to have ill `feelings towards you at all.. Rather, az we would wonder if~you had some sort of pull with Bryant :Moynihan or .any of the McNear a3 trustees, and if we could get some sort of win-win situation we're extending the, olive branch. as Thank you. as Vice .Mayor Maguire:. Madam Mayor? Guy, could you repeat when you're having a6 that meeting? When and where? Key to abbreviations: 1H-CouricilmembenJane Hamilton, 1VR-Courrcilmember,Nancy Read' PH-MayorMPatriciaFlil/igoss; MSCourrcilmemberMaryStompe. DK Councilmember David Keller; PT Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire August, 24, 1998 Vo1.3~., Page 205 i Guy Gillon:- It's at 9 Eddie Court, the top of the cul-de-sac overlooking the ex- z forest, at 7 p.m. this Thursday. Thank you. 3 Mayor Hilligoss: Janice Cader-Thompson? No, thank you? Okay. Then council a comment. s COUNCIL. COMMENTS s Councilwoman Stompe: Madam Mayor? I've been contacted by a couple of people ~ that sat on the Petaluma River Enhancement Committee. And one of them was John a Fitzgerald, and the other was Chris McAuliffe, regarding the D Street bridge and the retrofit 9 that is supposed to happen on the bridge. And as part of the river enhancement plan, I io believe there was supposed to be some sort of connection under the bridge. And I know that ii we've delayed the scheduling of the seismic retrofit because we wanted to make sure we iz could accommodate the traffic in the downtown area. But when we do .have the D Street 13 bridge out of commission'for 5 months, that possibly we could do some sort of improvements is to connect what was put forth in the river enhancement plan to connect under the D Street is bridge,. so I'd really like staff to take a look at that and report back to us, and see if that's a i6 possibility. Thank you. i~ Councilwoman Hamilton: Madam Mayor? I'm very much in favor of looking at, is seeing if we can do that sidewalk while the bridge is out, so that we don't have to double our 19 efforts. And I was going to ask for that also. I keep hearing from members of the zo community who are concerned about dredging, and I think this is, I brought it up, I'd like to zi have a, I think we need a report at a council meeting in the evening to get some answers out zz and to really talk about it, because there's a lot of concern in the community. I just, we got a z3 memo from Mike Everett about Cortez Drive, and the reconstruction of Cortez Drive, and I za would like the city manager to commend Mike Everett for his efforts, and for the way he zs dealt with this neighborhood. I was at a couple neighborhood meetings where Mike, I was z6 just so impressed with how he handled himself and with the work he's done on this project, z~ and with how we've been able to respond to this neighborhood's concern. when at the outset it zs looked like there was absolutely nothing we could for them, and I was really happy to read z9 his report that we're gonna be able to get some of the funding for the street. 3o City Manager Fred Stouder: Thank you, I will pass that comment on. And on your 31 first question, the contract has been .scheduled. It's on the future council agendas for the first 3z meeting of September for the council to award the contract to do dredging. 33 Councilwoman Hamilton: Oh, great. Okay. And finally, Madam Mayor, we had a 3a memo from Tom Hargiss saying that he attended a meeting regarding efforts to create a San 3s Pablo Bay watershed organization. And I was very interested to read about it, and I'm 36 looking forward to hearing more about it, and I just think this is a completely worthwhile 37 effort for our city to be involved in. 38 Councilwoman Read: Following up on .Councilmember Hamilton's question on the 39 dredging, -have we heard from FEMA yet? If they're willing to pick p their participation ao share? ai City Manager Fred Stouder: I don't know if Tom has some news he can share with us az tonight or not on that. 43 City Engineer Tom Hargis: If we aren't there we're very close. And we expect by the as award to be there. as Councilwoman Read: Thank you. Thank you, Madam Mayor. Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss, MS Councilmember Mary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 206, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 i Councilman Keller: Madam Mayor, it's 'good to be back in 1?etaluma. 'It's been, a .long z time. I just got off the plane and got into town about a half an hour ago from -Atlanta for a 3 week, and then 3. weeks, prior to that in England. There's some wonderful places out: there, a but this is still home, so I'm glad to be back. s Mayor Hilligoss: I wanted to say something to the doctor. Some years, ago I was on 6 the Parks & Recreation Committee. And we went. out there to Cherry Valley School, :and we ~ wanted to build a .park out there for the people out ,there. And' they said no, they didn't want s it. They wanted ..some: slides and things for their school, .and. so that's what we did. And that's: 9 the park. But that's what they wanted.. They didn't, we were going. to put it right ~at the top io of the hill, so I just would like you to know that we tried to give you a,park. Okay, then we'll ~ ~ move on to the public hearing on. Lafferty draft- environmental impact report. And if iz everybody, try'to stick to the 3 minutes or so, we'd appreciate it. 13 LAFFERTY,DRAI~T'EIR PiTBLIC HEAI~NG is .Planning; Director Tuft: Thank you. Madam Mayor and.: City Council members. is Tonight we bring you the' draft EIR and draft management. plan for the Lafferty Ranch park. 16 You have before you all comments received. until 7 p.m. this .evening. I'd like` to thank. Jim i~ Carr, who stayed with me .after 5 .and helped me assemble the extra. packets that were is received today. Both the Parks; Music, & Recreation Commission and the Planning 19. Commission have reviewed -and. considered and .given testimony on.the adequacy ofthe. draft zo EIR and draft. management. plan. You have the staff reports presented. to those two zi omissions, as well as the minute excerpts. from their actions and their recommendations to zz you on the adequacy of the document. This. evening, we've asked the EIR consultant, 23 Leonard Charles, to present a brief summary of the EIR anal the EIR process to you., You. za received some time ago the actual draft document, and the management. plan. This is your zs evening to listen, to receive public input from. the public. Followi~ig this evening's meeting, z6 we respectfully ask. the city council to consider holding a special meeting on Tuesday, z~ September 1st, to offer your comments to .staff on the adequacy of the EIR. The consultant za and the executive team working, on this project. for you .have started. preparing the .responses z9 to comments, and we look forward. to completing that task. If you have any questions, the 3o actions to date by staff, I'd be glad `to turn it over to Leonard' Charles.. 31 Councilwoman Read: .A question of the planning director, Madam Mayor, first.. So 3z that I can get this clear; you've got no responses to comments back: from the June 30th joint 33 planning commission. and recreation commission meeting. But. you do foresee that they will 34 be back by September lst? 3s .Planning Director Tuft: No. The, at this point. in time, we'we brought. the draft. EIR, 36 the. exact same document the planning commission and the; music, :parks, :and', no .I .did that 37 wrong; parks, music, and recreation commission. heard. They held a joint meeting. And then 3a separately those 2 commissions went back and held their own meeting, concluded the .review, 39 and offered staff comments. `Th_ose comments basically carry forward 'as similar cornirients,as ao we received from the ,public, in fact, the volumes that we have received from. the public on at this project. And we will be preparing those responses,.. and: following tonight's meeting;.. az followings the receipt of council comments on the ,adequacy of the draft EIR, we will prepare a3 the responses to comments and bring everything back to both. the. planning commission, both as the music, parks, and recreation commissions, because they have asked for. an opportunity to as review the final EIR. So we will bring everything back.. a6 Councilwoman Read: And just to follow up; .Madam Mayor, do you. have a time line a~ then, if we take testimony this evening, and then on September lst; the council is given their .Key to abbreviations: JH=Councilmember Jane: Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-Councilmember Mary Stompe DK Councilmember David 'Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela TorGatt M1V1-.Dice Mayor Matt Maguire . ~.~;~; .,r, August~24, 1998 Vo1.3~„ Page 207 r opportunity to give input, when you think that, whether you consider it an addendum, or z responses to comments, when do you think that document will be back? 3 Planning ..Director Tuft: We're going to be shooting for getting the final EIR a document to the 2 commissions in November, beginning of November, with bringing it on to s council in late November or early December. 6 Councilwoman Read: Right. Thank you, Madam Mayor, for that clarification. ~ Thank you. a Mayor Hilligoss: If there are no other questions, we'll go onto the... 9 Planning Director Tuft: I'd like to introduce Leonard Charles, Leonard Charles and io Associates. ii Mayor Hilligoss: Oh, that's right. Yeah, we want to have him. iz Leonard Charles: Good evening. 13 Vice Mayor Maguire: Leonard, is your mike on? is Leonard Charles (author of Draft EIR): I'll try and make this brief. This is a process is that began about a year ago, and it was an integrated planning process, in that we were hired 16 by the city to first look at the site to determine whether there were significant constraints on i~ the site that would prohibit public use of it, or that might constrain it m a significant fashion. is And so our firm, along with about 8 or 6 or 8 specialists of consultants, did analyze the site, i9 prepared a constraints and opportunities. report. Then based on that constraints and zo opportunities report, working with the Lafferty Access Committee, we prepared the draft zi management plan. Now, because we'd already done a considerable amount of the zz environmental work in preparing the constraints and opportunities report, a lot of the z3 problems that could be foreseen for public use of the site were, quote unquote, mitigated by za programs and actions that. were: recommended in the draft management plan. Then we zs prepared, once that draft management plan was completed, we prepared the draft z6 environmental impact report where we had all the experts go back and look at the final plan z~ that the access committee adopted, to determine. whether there. were other additional impacts zs that hadn't been addressed in that first constraints and opportunities report. And now, as was z9 just ;stated, we're in. the final. EIR stage where all these comment letters that have been 3o received by various members ofthe public, as well as verbal things,. we will respond to those, 3i again as a neutral party, and then. you will have in front of you this large body of data 3z including probably ome disagreements about impacts. But it will all be there in front of you, 33 hopefully in a somewhat clear fashion. Just briefly, the plan has a number of programs, a use 34 program, and as you know,. it .restricts use to fairly low-level hiking only, no dogs, no 3s equestrians, nq bicycles.. Small parking lot, 15-space parking lot that could be expanded to 36 30 spaces if needed. It has - an access program that delineates the 4 trails that were 37 recommended. There's a main trail that goes from the parking lot up to the north. end of the 3s :property,. and then 3 other trails that are off of that, one of which. will be made accessible for 39 people, disabled people. There's a signs program that lays out all the various signs, telling ao you what you can and can't do and where they are all supposed to be. There's a grazing ai management program that tells how the grazing will. occur. Grazing will occur between the az months of March and June. It will be kept out of all sensitive areas, and there's a whole lot of a3 detail in there which I won't bother with you, with at this time. There's a fire management as program, that in addition to the various prohibitions against smoking or any sort of open as flame on the property, the city fire department will be first responder to any call for fire at the a6 site. The city will put in a 20,000-gallon water storage tank, will continue grazing the Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-MayorM PatriciaHilligoss, MS-CouneilmemberMaryStompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt M1MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 208, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 i property to reduce grass fiiels: It-.will investigate if the property owners communable to if of z putting a road in on the north end to provide access to the north end.. The park will be closed 3 during high fire hazard days,. and a prescribed burning. w111, be considered to do, additional fuel a reduction in the, where the grasslands meet the woodlands and in other areas; Then there's a s hazards management program that essentially keeps people :out of hazardous areas, which are s essentially done by placing the trails in a place where they don't ~;o near those. There's a ~ monitoring program that tells how all these things will be monitored to make ;sure that what s the plan says and what; the EIR says is im fact what's occurring. .And then. there's a list' of 9 priorities that lists what things .should be done before the. park is .actually open..to the public, io and then. what things cam be done after that, as time and :money is available. The EIR. ii basically, I'll. just go through the categories real ;quickly: Geology, again which is staying out i2 of the hazardous areas,, there are .steep slopes, and, but you know, they're not` that- steep, 13 where the trails go are on existing roads: and. trails,: and compared. to, we're .currently doing,. is just beginning, to do a management plan for Cascade Open Space Preserve.. It's 1500 :acres in is Marin County, and the, we're replacing the trails; and this are considerably less steep, having i6 walked them the last 2 days, than ahe trails in Cascade Open Space Preserve. There ,is: some i~ erosion potential, but it's very minor, as Bill Cox of Fish & Game said, compared to -the is .natural slides that are already in, Adobe Creek, that it's immeasurable, what would come off 19 of any trail: construction_or use. Same. with hydrology; erosion potential. There are a couple so of major wetlands in the site that would be fenced off, ,, .so that people and cattle will. not be zi .allowed info them, and people will. essentially be kept out of most of Adobe Creek except for zz one area down near the diversion facility at'the south end. Vegetation, there's' a few ~sen"sitive z3 plants, not any rare and endangered ones, but trails have been kept: out of those !areas.. . sa They're kept out of the riparian zone, primarily, except again for that one exception: Kepti ss out of the wetlands: The grazing, management program is developed. in such a way as'to keep 26 the cattle out of wetlands and riparian sensitive areas.. Wildlife, the primary .two things is z~ there's potential for stcelhead on the site,. or of least we kngw they're 'below thee. site, and zs again, the effects of :erosion on those, Fish & Game believes is ?insignificant, but: we may do z9 some additional. work to clarify that issue: And'. the other :major issue is goldem eagles„ and 3o the eagles don't nest on this site, as far as we were able to determine or-Fish & Game was 31 able to determine. They do use it as part of their :foraging- territory.. The management= plan 3z has aspects in it to restrict use above. a certain point at the upper grasslands,, to -try to 33 minimize .:human. intru'sibn into their area, but in 'any case, it's not considered a aigrificant 3a impact, even if .there was some loss. of;foraging, habitat on the area: Fire, we did extensive 3s study of fire- histories in other parks; and .there's actually `very little emissions irr ,public .parks; 36 and they almost all have to do with barbecue and ;picnic areas, whlclh this .park does not have; - 37 or smoking related at the trail .head and ;parking lot where smokers tend. to .have :their last 3s cigarette and put it out, and. it doesn't always go out:. In this case, the parking ,lot will be 39 paved, the area around will be gravel. It'll be. mowed: In addition, you're not' supposed. to be ao smoking out there to begin with. 'So there's a very low likelihood of a fire ignition here: ai From what we've seen, the numbers of -fires that start out on trails; just is almost as immeasurable. It just doesn:t occur.. And -this site is not a particularly good site for arson, as because there's only one way in and' out, and it's quite visible when you park your car.. Of as course, you cam never get rid of that .problem, but it's ,not particularly- susceptible to that. as And then again,; as I said, there's' all: the mitigation measures in the management ,plan of how a6 to, even if a fire did' .start; to increase the ability of fire suppression :agencies to control it: with a7 the various water, roads, and the other things that I mentioned. Police,. again, the survey that as we did of other parks, that there's a very low- incidence of crime, on public parks; and it's a9 almost all; what's the word. I want, incidental. Vamdal, littering and minor vandalism.., is so primarily what it is. The records that Sonoma County did for other regional parks .here. And Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, IVR-Councilmember-.Nancy Read PH-tl~ayor M. ,Patricia Hilligoss, 1L1S-Councilmember Mary Stompe' DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-Yiee Mayor Matt Maguire f.. ~ 4 r kl~ ~ .q'. ..~.~:~ 1 August 24, 1998 Vo1.3'i,, Page '209 i again, there's a bunch of mitigation measures in the plan, various signings, the city police z department will. respond to any call from up these, because there was some concern the 3 County sheriffs department wouldn't be able to ,respond adequately.. The park will be closed a in the evening, with a locked gate, so that there won't be any access into the park after when s it is closed. At Sonoma Mountain Road will be a sign on both sides up and down from that 6 for no parking. Biodiversity: Again, I've already talked about the plants and the animals. ~ There are some .exotic plants on the property that the plan will get rid of. Land use: It was s determined that it will not significantly affect neighboring agricultural operations. In fact, it 9 will continue agricultural operations on this property, and it's basically consistent with the io County general plan. Aesthetics: Will affect slightly views for people who will travel past i i the sight. They'll see a parking lot. It'll affect, obviously, the vtews from the .Stamen iz .residence, which overlooks it, but that's the only residence that would actually have a view of 13 it. Same with noise, it really will be only the .Stamen residence that would be potentially is affected by it, by hearing. people talking when they get out of their cars and walk across the is field. So the main impact that the E1R determined was traffic safety on Sonoma Mountain 16 Road. It was determined based on a lot of work we did trying to figure this out, but i~ essentially that on an average weekday there'd be 36 to 60 trips, so that's 18 to 25 cars. A is trip is, one car going up and coming back down the hill is two trips. So 36 to 60 trips in a 19 weekday, and 52 to 82 trips on a weekend. Sonoma County requested that we use these zo nationally, national standards that are called ASHTO, I'm .sure you've all seen this name now, zi a bunch of times, ASHTO standards to determine the adequacy of the road. And of course zz the road doesn't :meet those standards, which are essentially that it has to be at least two 10- 23 foot wide travel lanes and two-foot wide gravel shoulders. So a request to the County, the za traffic engineers broke this down into, I believe, it was 200-foot segments, 76 segments. zs Fifty of those segments need widening. Seventy of them need shoulders. .Fifty-six need z6 pavement repair, four sections need rails, and then there's one bad section, for those of you z~ who know it, .where the road makes a 90-degree turn and there's a house right on the road, zs that needs more major improvements. We assumed that the city was not going to fund the z9 improvements of that entire three-plus mile .section of road, so the EIR concludes that that's a 3o significant safety impact, unless you did decide that you wanted to bring the road up entirely 31 to those .standards. With the 9 alternatives, 3 of them were varieties of no-project 3z alternatives: one was to leave it as a nature preserve, one was to sell it to a agricultural 33 operator, one was to sell it to someone who could develop it for residences based on the 34 county general plan, which would allow as many as 4 homes on the property. We looked at 2 3s alternatives under that, the construction of 4 homes and the construction of 2 homes. 36 Alternative two was restricted use, which would allow public use but only under docent or 37 some form of guided, people under guidance going onto it. Alternative three was increased 3s use, allowing more use, picnics and other increased use of the park. Number four was the 39 park would be closed during the fire season, between May 15th and October 15th. ao Alternative five was alternative location, and we looked at 2 alternative locations, one being ai the Moon Ranch, and one being the Galvin or property,, or the Triangle G Ranch, which is, daz adjoins the Moon Ranch on the north, I believe. We assessed all those, saw what the impacts a3 were, and the EIR is not, is not a policy document, so it's not for us to say what's a better as place for a park, so we didn't get into that issue. All we are supposed to do is identify the as environmentally superior alternative. In this case, the alternative two of restricted use, which a6 would allow public use, which meets most of the goals that the city set forth. in the project, a~ though it obviously restricts public use, would be the environmentally superior alternative. as That's it in a nutshell. a9 Vice Mayor Maguire: Madam Mayor? Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-Councilmember Mary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 210, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 i Mayor Hihigoss: Yes. z Vice Mayor Maguire:: Thank you. Leonard, you know we've received. a fair amount. 3 of recent. stufftoday in terms of response: Some of.it's repetitious; .refers back`to older letters a and stuff, and I presume staff is copying you on this pretty much as soon as it comes in. Do s you have any idea how long it's :gonna take,. ;just from what you've seen in terms of the. 6 written comments, for you to respond to those things? Just ballpark? I won't: hold you to it. ~ Leonard Charles: I haven't_read That latest section.. And it;:. fairly lengthy, so I'm not s really sure what 'is in there that's'. beyond what we've already started working on,; We are" 9 doing a couple of additional studies, just to .corroborate some of'the things in;the EIR. I'd be io really loathe to ,even: give you a guess: I would say probably" we're gonna have something. to i i staff in about 3 weeks. But then, it has ~to go through.. a bunch. of other reviews; so;.. Y gu~ 13 a chance lto. see that,I yooure: Okay, well maybe when you get it, you know, once you've .had. could let staff know and they can report back to us. Thanks, is Leonard. is Mayor Hilligoss: Okay, then.:James Mobley? i6 James Mobley: Good evening, Madame Mayor and City Council members..,' `My name i~ is Jim Mobley. 'I'm a commissioner of the park, music and ;recreation commission, and.. also is I'm a member of the Lafferty access comrtuttee. And I wanted to speak a few moments on i9 that issue tonight. First I would like to take this opportunity to comimend the members of the': zo access committee for the work they did in developing the framework :for the management zi plan. This was an. exercise in patience and perseyera_nce. While the atmosphere at times was zz contentious, through consensus we developed what I consider`to lie a good product.. Let me z3 say that through this whole process, our meetings were; always publicized, always open to the za public, and in that regards `I feel that we encouraged public input, from anyone 'who was. zs mte"rested, We accepted the challenge and lived up to our charge to develop a sound, z6 framework for the: management plan for Lafferty. I would, add that not everyone got what. z~ they wanted, and not" everybody was. happy with the process,, or the final product. I would zs also like to thank. Leonard Charles & .Associates for the -work. they .did' in taking our z9 framework to develop. a good .management plan and a good. draft EIR. To my .neighbors on 3o Sonoma 1VIou..,ntain I would say that this is riot, there is not a one of ti's who doesn't share your 3 i concerns of vandalism, trespassing, litter, access, and fire. Yet on the .other hand, there is no 3z concrete evidence that opening Lafferty Ranch according to the.management plan will see an 33 increase in these ;activities. I truly believe: that knowing people would show up at :any time 34 would make those who would. do such things. think twice before acting. In regards to the 3s road, I can :only say that "there are other roads just as dangerous.in Sonoma County, and that 36 is not so much the road as. if is people. doing dumb things. I take .exceptionwith the draft 37 EIR because I': think ~yqu're .going to -see the Traffic, not that is"anticipated,. excuse me, you're 3s gonna see the traffic is not. gonria_be as heavy as anticipated.. But. only time will -bear this out. 39 :Now the. county wants to tiring the road up to ASHTO standards when they don't :apply the ao same standards to other questionable. roads to other parks in Sonoma: County. Finally,, I ai believe that there are enough people iri Petaluma who "will.. volunteer to help watch .over az Lafferty Ranch, to make sure that we are good :neighbors. This is a good: draft EIR, a good a3 management .plan, and when the time comes, I urge you, to certify us so that' we can proceed as towards developing, t_he physical- means to make Lafferty Ranch a reality. Thank. you, as Mayor Hilligoss` Bruce Hagen. a~ Bruce Hagen: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Council .members.. I hate submitted a~ my comments in writing, ..and also orally in front of the recreation, music and parks Key to abbreviations: JH=.Councilmember Jane, Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss, MS-CourxcilmemberMaryStompe DK. -- Councilmember David'Keller, PT=Councilmember Pamela Torliaft MM--Vice. Mayor MatfMaguire "~{ AugusY24, 1'998 Vo1.3~, Page 211 i commission.. There is a few things that I wanted to emphasize. I think the EIR ,probably z typically looks at the impacts, the negative impacts, and they assume the benefits. But I think 3 it needs to say more about what the benefits of having a wilderness park so close to an urban a area are. I won't go into those. I elaborated that to some degree. But I think it's very s important, because that's .really what's driving all the people who have come up here month 6 after month, year after year, to pursue this, to have a park that we can go onto without being ~ watched over or without having to sign up first. 'That, I would like to submit for the record s the rest of this document that you have all probably seen. It's the complete history and a case 9 for keeping Lafferty Ranch as of about 2 years ago, and it has quite a bit of information about io the public demand for a park like Lafferty. I think another benefit that gets touched on but ii needs to be emphasized is one I mentioned earlier, and James pointed out briefly, is that the iz presence of people of law-abiding, caring people going up and down that road to visit the 13 park is going to be a deterrent effect, if not a crime reporting effect, that will minimize the is impact of the people who are already going up there to do bad things. Let's see. The other is thing I think needs emphasizing is that the best management practices, this is in my letter, ..it's 16 in my statements, the reason for this park was to, or the reason for that was that the, the i~ architects of the legislation that. the council passed had in mind a park that was like all the is other ones publicly owned in the Bay Area, where people could just go up there whenever 19 they wanted, unless there was extreme fire danger, or in this case, nighttime, there is no zo evidence that I've seen anywhere so far that suggests any publicly owned property requires u docent supervision or a registration in advance, or. getting keys. And I've hiked in lots of zz places, and others have hiked in even more. Even Yellowstone National Park, where you can z3 fall into a [inaudible], and wipe out something that's been there for 20,000 years, doesn't even za have :you sign up, much less be supervised. So that's really important. The document I have zs states that the EIR needs to be modified to state That there are no alternatives that meet that z6 criteria, other -than the recommended alternative. I'd also call to your attention, on page 8, z~ the project objectives does not include that point. And again, when we drafted this zs ordinance, we had in mind maximizing the public benefit, consistent with protection and z9 enhancement :and. restoration of the land. The language' didn't .get in the ordinance, nor did it 3o get in here, but I think it's pretty clear to anybody who's been involved, is that we want to try 31 to get as many people up there as possible and still be sensitive to the environmental 3z conditions on the- property. That precludes registration, it precludes quotas, it precludes 33 docents, docent-led tours. And it's too late to amend the project objectives, but I wanted that 34 to be noted for the record. And those are all the comments I have. Thank you. Oh, and 3s thanks very much to Leonard Charles for all. the hard work he's done, and all the hard -work 36 he has yet to do to finish this process, and to Pamela and her staff, and these guys I guess 37 have done two or three jobs already this years.. ~ I'd like to extend my .congratulations to them, ss and all the rest. of you: I think this thing is getting close to the end, and I'm feeling pretty 39 good about it. Thanks. ao Mayor, Hilligoss: Thank you. T. Keith Gurnee. ai Keith'Gurnee: Madam Mayor and members of the council, my name is Keith Gurnee, az representing the Sonoma Mountain Conservancy, 600 Sonoma Mountain Road. In deference a3 to your comment to keep it to 3 minutes, I will. I recently submitted, today, my written as comments as a person who's been working with the conservancy. I am one of 30 people, as over 30 people, that have submitted written comments, who are involved with the a6 conservancy, ranging from concerned property owners and ranchers to experts in the field of a~ biology, fire management, range management, legal issues, biological issues, etcetera. as Tonight is the night for you to listen, and to basically direct your staff and your environmental 49 impact consultant, Mr. Charles, to respond thoroughly and completely to all the comments Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-Councilmember Mary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 212, Vol, 32 August 24, 1998 ~ received, and L sincerely hope that does.'happen.: I would. like to echo the comments of Mr. z Hagen for thanking the ,staff and Mr. Charles; :.he's done a lot of work. here. I think he knows 3 he has a lot more work to do. But we have provided all of our comments, inywritng and in a detail, and I believe you should `have a copy of all the comments that we've made: In closing. s I would like to say that one matter in particular is of particular importance to us, Mr: Charles. 6 found: that Sonoma Mountan.Road was a significant impact that. needs to be mitigated.. And ~ if the, if public access to this proposed park;is to, be. safe and secure,. then I: don't see how you. s can .open a park on Lafferty, at Lafferty Ranch, without dealing thoroughly and' exhaustively 9 with correcting. the dangerous conditions on Sonoma Mountain. Road. Finally; we :hate to addressed some alternatives that°we think better meet yourproject objectives without causing: i i near the impacts, and we will. be looking forward' to Mr. Charles'' response to those comments iz as well. Thank you, t3 Mayor Hihigoss:, Thank you. Jerry Price? to Jerry Pricey: Well, as a side.note, I'm Jerry Price of.Petalumz~, and I'd like to hope that is Mr. Keller, when he was n'the United Kingdom, had. the opportunity~to experience some of i6 their vast network of public bails on .privately owned. land. -You did? Wonderful:.I'm Jerry t~ Price. I am :not a paid consultant, I'm a citizen; resident of Petaluma. Usually, an EIR or is environmental impact report review, is done so the public: can comment on the. negative 19 aspects of a commercial or residential development. This plan.. simply asks for the public to zo be allowed to walk. on publicly owned. land. So it is with this in'mind that I encourage:,the. zi city council to support this .environmental impact review and to -adopt and .implement the zz access plan as presented. It is my opinion that the city-appointed Lafferty access committee z3 and our .environmental consultant, Mr: Charles, have bent over backwards. to deal with the za concerns that have :been. presented, both_ real and; perceived; and that they.have done so, even zs to the point of compromising the stated goals of'the project. I: should like to'offer a point of z6 clarification ~to a comment which was made at the Petaluma planning commission hearing on. z~ this matter. Mr. Keith Gurnee held himself'out as a representative of the Sonoma Mountain zs Conservancy. I sfill d.o not know who that ,is: One of Mr..Gurnee's~ comments referenced the z9 comparison of Moon Ranch. as an .alternative, to the ;proposed trail, project at Lafferty':Ranch:; 3o Mr. Gurnee stated that the Sonoma. County agriculture ,preservation and, open space'..d;istrict 3t even paid a premium. price for the Forever wild easement placed upon Moon„Ranch, thereby 3z implying Moon was a more desirable wild open space area. Well, ladies and gentlemen, Mr.: 33 Gurnee is certainly correct on this. one point. The Sonoma .Count=~ agriculture preservation 34 and open space: district .paid a huge premium for the development rights; on ..Moon ;Ranch. I 3s would like to paraphrase a statement which was made. recently by the United States,.Court of° 36 Appeals, relative fo another development project in Sonoma County: There, would. be the 37 appearance of an unholy alliance between the developer and Sonorraa :County public officials. 3s We would hope and expect that Sonoma County public officials wc-uld obey their own .laws,. 39 .and listen to the wishes of their citizens. On the: issue of 1:4 million dollars being paid to Mr.. ao Peter Pfendler for the development. rights to 'prevent 5 new homed on. Moon Ranch,, L will ai state: There would be the appearance of an unholy alliance: between. Mr. Pfendler .and az Sonoma County public officials, and I would hope and expect that Sonoma; County public 43 officials would. obey their own laws and 'listen and act- upon the vi!ishes of their :citizens. 1.4 as million dollars. of Sonoma County taxpayers' .dollars has been given away- to Mr. Pfendler as essentially as the result of a handwritten.. letter from the same. Mr. Keith Gurnee in the fall of a6 1995. In so doing, our county supervisors have given up a huge bargaining :chip in dealing as would be here today, working througr this rveawa of 1;4' Pllion dollars rt is unliykeanch. h a.fulgenviror mental im act review on Laffert Ry We a9 I would be happy to share the sordid details of this giveaway v~nth anyone; and I .stress Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton; NR-Gourrcilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss, MS-Councilmember MaryStompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pbmela Torliatt tl~l%t Vice~MayorMattMaguire August 24,.:1998 Vo1.31., Page 213 i anyone. My phone number is Jerry Price, 763-76.1.0. Jerry Price, 763-7610. I personally z believe this issue should be investigated by the U.S. Department of Justice. 3 Mayor Hllligoss: Pat Cheda? a Pat Cheda? s Mayor Hilligoss: Pat Cheda? 6 Pat Cheda: Madam, Chairman, Councilmen. My name is Pat Cheda, 3272 Old ~ Adobe Road. Mr. Keller, I hope I understood you right at your last meeting, and if not, I s stand corrected. But this is the way I understood it. I would like to start with a statement to 9 Mr. Keller made after the last. hearing. If I heard right, you corrected me on people io developing on the mountain road and. not paying the price. I believe you used Barry ii Lawrence's name and his winery. I believe you said he did not wish to pay or improve the iz road conditions. When I approached Barry Lawrence, I asked why he did not have to pay. 13 His answer was, I do not have a winery, I only have a vineyard. I believe you said somebody is got you there,. got the information for you, so if you would, please check the other examples is you gave for correctness. Meeting on the planning commission yourself, I don't think you let 16 many, if any, opportunities go by. I know the county would not allow this either, so I'm i~ hoping that I understood you right. Back to the EIR, on page 161 with fire hazards, you say is that there will not be any night usage. I thought there was night usage, but it's fine with me if i9 there isn't. On page 163, land use, when development comes next to ag, ag has the right to zo farm ordinance. That gives us some protection. After all, this is an ag county. On page 164 zi and 165, alternative two, I would like to think that some kind of fire control would be zz necessary, if only grazing. Otherwise, it becomes a fire trap. Fire could totally destroy the z3 beauty of that mountain that has been maintained for so many years by the landowners. za Thank you. zs Mayor Hilligoss: Kay Russo? z6 Kay Russo: Thank you, Madam Mayor and Council members. I'm here before you z~ once again to ask some questions that we began asking the city of Petaluma in April of 1997. za Our questions .have still not been answered. I'm speaking on behalf of myself, as a longtime z9 citizen of Petaluma, and as a member of the board of directors for the Sonoma County 3o taxpayers' association. And with me this evening is our executive director, Jane Marie 31 Foster. You all .have a copy of the letter that I submitted, which is basically just a more 3z detailed version of what you have gotten on 3 other occasions, so I'm going to read this into 33 the record. To Mayor Hllligoss and Council members: After reading the Lafferty Ranch 3a .park draft, management plan and draft environmental impact report, I submit the following 3s questions for the record: As you may recall, the Sonoma County taxpayers' association 36 submitted -most of these questions on April 9th, 1997; June 18th, 1997; and September 30th, 3~ 1997. Today we have not received a complete response from the city of Petaluma. I ask 3s these questions as a resident of Petaluma, and a member of the board of directors of the 39 .Sonoma County taxpayers' association. I look forward to receiving specific responses to ao each of my'concerns, and I am asking that those responses please be in writing. Not from the ai dias. We want them in writing. .Number one: As currently envisioned, the Petaluma Police az Department and Petaluma .Fire Department will be asked to service Lafferty Ranch and a3 Sonoma Mountain Road, an area three and a half miles from the city limits. This as commitment, made without the authorizations of the city of, citizens of Petaluma, while be as expensive and undoubtedly reduce the level of service to the citizens within the city limits of a6 Petaluma. Please provide a complete protection plan for both the police and. fire a~ departments, including the specific costs, expected manpower estimates, cooperative Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss; MS-Councilmember MaryStompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt 111111-Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 214, Vol: 32 August 24, 1998 i agreements with other agencies, and do so projected over [end of tape] ..:including the z Sonoma County Sheriffs Department; Petaluma Police Department,. 'fire;.. paramedic- and 3 others concerning providing this service: Please. provide bath inter- and intea-city a communications concerning this topic. Number two: The Sonoma County taxpayers'. s association, in our written .communication to tNe city of Petaluma dated June. 2nd, '1997, 6 stated: Other :park jurisdictions, calculate cost. benefit and park planning.. as a prudent ~ measure to project unit costs. per-visitor to a facility.. If the Petaluma has not done: this in the s past, it could be than. they are not qualified to .develop other than urbane parks fore usage is 9 normally .greater. They should .not proceed. without some :approximate projections about io costs. Please ,provide a .cost benefit analysis. Number three: An article in a recent issue of ri the Press Democrat discussed the fact that the city has budgeted only $19;0,000 irrthe coming. iz budget for road repair citywide. This appears to be a static number indicating that; 13 significantly more revenue will not be, directed to this budget item. How 'is the city prepared is to pay for the .needed repairs to .Sonoma Mountain Road? Would you please provide a is specific -road construction and maintenance plan. for 'the county and city's share of the i6 improvements and maintenance, and please do so in specific terms that address the revenue i~ source, what. part of the budget this will be taken from; and costs for up to 5 years 'in, they is future: The EIR does not adequately address annual.. costs of operating Lafferty Ranch as a 19 public :resource: Since the funding 'for such expenses must. come :from the general fund,, has. zo the city studied the question of annual-.cost and if so would:,, you please provide the cost? If zi not, please provide, a report that lists. expected costs, ..including, projected park° construction: zz and maintenance, ,police and fire service, liability insurance, ADA accessibility; and general z3 personnel costs' on a yearly basis: Please also project how many; -how costs may rise :in the za next 5 years. Number five: The: question o£ Moon Ranch as a significant alternative. to zs Lafferty is greatly .understated. _ For instance, the report fails to mention the cumulative z6 benefits of Moon Ranch, including the disclosure that the Moon 7E~anch alternative, has the z~ large public benefit of preserving the entire 270 acre Lafferty Ranch in. perpetuity as a zs wilderness preserve, while at the. same time providing; a substantiaA ;general use park,. -Moon. z9 Ranch; for the citizenry: 'Please ;address the overall benefits of Moon Ranch as an alternative, 3o including the potential for 270 acres of additional open .space at Lafferty. This one issue 31 alone was perhaps the most significant :factor cited by the Sonoma County agriculture 3z preservation and open space district in ;providing 1.4 million dollars of public funds for this 33 project. Number six: The Sonoma County taxpayers' association previously requested 3a information. on right-gf--way acquisition costs: Please provide. cost estimates as to the 3s projected .condemnation of property, including condemnation relative :to the needed 36 improvements to Sonoma Mountain Road: Please do so by identifying to the extent possible 37 which properties will' be affected along Sonoma 'Mountain 'Road leading: to Lafferty:, Please 3a also estimate le al fees associated with said acquisition; and any exposure owing to the g 39 dinvnution of land values associated with the development of a park at Lafferty. Number ao seven: Can the city use Lafferty,, which. once belonged to a separately delineated water ai entity, for purposes other than a water .source, and can that, be. done without compensating az the taxpayers, the residents of.Petaluma, who originally paid. for :a water source, not a °public a3 park? Can.-this transaction be considered a gift of public funds,, ;and-:has the legality been 4a researched? Finally; number eight: Please provide an estimate of past,, ongoing,. and °fiiture as .legal and staff costs associated with development of this park.. PlE~ase do so on a line item as basis, including a projection of "staff costs that currently are: being` devoted to the projection a~ on a daily basis, yet do not appear in budget °projections. or repast. Thank you for your as attention to my concerns. The Sonoma County taxpayers and I wait for your full. response to a9 our specific concerns. Thank you very much. _. ~~~#/f## Key to abbreviationsc JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, IVR-Councilmember-Nancy-Read PH:MayorM. Patricia Hilligoss, MS Councilmem_6erMary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM---Vice Mayor MatfMaguire L~.~`' ~ i` • i t August 24, 1998 Vo1:31, Page 215 i Councilwoman Torliatt: Madam Mayor? I just want to state, thank you, Kay. for z your comments,- and as you stated, you did provide them to the councit in venting, which I 3 had read. And just for the public, giving input, if you have provided this information in a writing to the council it will be addressed m the response to comments, so you don't s necessarily have to read it directly into the microphone for it to be incorporated. So, just as a 6 time-saving measure, just be aware of that. So, I just appreciate that. Thank you. ~ Mayor Hilligoss: Randall Smith: a Randall Smith: Madam Mayor, City Council. My name's Randall Smith. I live on 9 Sonoma Mountain Road and I'm not here to voice a great big complaint about the Lafferty io Ranch as much as I am to_sort of express dismay and a bit of sorrow that this process seems ii to be one of the tail wagging the dog. Yes. Everybody's in favor of a park. And as far as I iz can. see the fact that the City of Petaluma owns the property at Lafferty has motivated this 13 motion towards making a park at Lafferty. The thing is there's no direct connection there. is The fact that the City owns the property at Lafferty does not qualify Lafferty as particularly is good park terrain. And it's been turned down~in the past, I think by the County over the past i6 several years. It seems that Lafferty with such great expense will offer so little benefit in the i~ way of actual use to so few people and I think that this is fairly well acknowledged not only is by the EIR but even by the descnption as a wilderness park. Now, ladies and gentlemen, that i9 term sounds to me like an oxymoron, because a park and the wilderness are mutually zo exclusive in my mind. Wilderness is wilderness because it's not a park. In fact, people who zi are as good as just about everybody here, and I dona claim to know these people, but they all zz seem. very well intended, very respectful. If this were only the kind of people that would be z3 using the park I would think there would really be no problem with it as far as damage to us za residents on the mountain and the mountain in general. But unfortunately, it's a case of bad zs apple being able to really spoil the entire barrel. And in this case the mountain is so fragile, z6 particularly with .regard. to fire, that I .have a hard time-countenancing any increase in risk. I z~ want to discuss that in a moment, but this notion of the good people versus the bad. I have zs here, and if the Council got the pictures, here's a picture of the entrance at Lafferty, z9 everybody. I think you can see the kind of disrespect none of you would dare show. I 3o certainly wouldn't. We :got .gang graffiti, beer cans. This was taken last week. Here's a 31 picture I took today on the way down the mountain. to work. How's that look? Everybody 3z see that? 33 ?? Where is it? 34 Randall Smith: This is about two-thirds of the way up to Lafferty. Here. I think you 3s should have a look at these. As ~I- mentioned, my big„concern,. my biggest concern, actually 36 there's fwo. My biggest concern that will affect me the greatest is a big,, fire. Aside from that, 37 I would really like to hear why Moon. Ranch isn't obviously the superior alternative. If the 3s. goal is to preserve Lafferty and at the same time provide recreational outdoor opportunities 39 for the people of Petaluma, then getting. on with the Moon Ranch proposal, which I believe ao could still be accomplished, obviously achieves both of those as well as it heals the rift in the ai neighborhood. I would like to hear from any council member, and I sincerely invite a az response here as to what it is about Lafferty that makes it such a superior alternative that the 43 Moon consideration.. has been basically put onto a back burner. I hope I get that answer as tonight, or I would like to see it in the newspaper, or I'd like to see it somewhere. Now, let as me talk about. the fire in the EIR. I understand the need for the EIR and I understand the a6 complaints regarding the EIR. I've read most of the EIR, and I think Mr. Charles did a really a~ good job. However, it does seem to me that it is a case of research where the desired as conclusion is known in advance of the research, and the research as much as possible. It's Key to abbreviations: JH-Couneilmerriber Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss, MS-Councilmember MaryStompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 216, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 i written to amve at the foregone .conclusion. And I don't..fault. you fir doing. that. I think you. z did a good job. And I think:' that -your conclusions, :though. they tend to become: 3 overshadowed by the body of this problem, that problem,, the other problem, the ,next a problem, and how we can rrutigate all these problems, I flunk that v~rhen you :actually hit your s conclusion, both tonight and previously,, that the truth. comes out. Namely; the best 6 environmental use. for' Lafferty is nothing: The :next best is a .little bit of something. And. so I ~ ask again how much time; how much money, is going to be continued to be spent. Here we s are two, three years later into this process. You're no closer, I don't. think,. to having a park 9 at Lafferty than you were two or three years .ago:. Or maybe you're much closer: I don't io know. I don't think so. I want. to comment to again the fire point of the EIR because, again i i that concerns me the most. If signage were effective a hundred percent, then. I would agree. iz that the fire danger is mitigated. But signs are easily ignored. For example, you make "the 13 point of well, we'll close the park -and we'll post' it with no parking signs. I have experience is with no parking igns on the road. Because occasionallywhen `I see somebody parking there; is and no parking sign that obviously doesn't. look like they belong there; I'll stop and ask them. 16 Because there isn't a legitimate goal..for. anybody on the Lafferty :on Sonoma:Mountain,Road i~ at this time, it can be assumed that they're trespassing, first of :all'by their mere presence. in the. rs car, but if they're: not in the car you know they've hopped ,the fence and. they're trespassing. 19 And you :usually .can find them pretty .quickly.: And: they act appropriately guilty, .because zo they know they ..shouldn't be there: However; 'the mere fact of the: signage doesn't. stopthem zi from parking. there.. I asked one of the .neighbors how come he doesn't, have. the- no parking. zz signs up.at his particularly .popular place,. and he says I'm tired of replacing them.. A1T they do z3 is throw them down the hill. And then. when I go to talk to the people, the response is hey, 2a there's not a no parking sign .here: Because they just tore_it off`and threw it down the hill. zs But. back to the fire Here. Okay. It's been proposed to put a 20,x00 gallon storage: tank :at z6 the bottom of `the,, of Lafferty. Fill it with water. I, haven't heard where the water's going to z~ come from, but T know that there's' not going to be electricity_at Lafferty. So that means to zs me that since we're relying on gravity,, the tanks' at the bottom.. won't do anything; :until :a, z9 pumper truck has. arrived from wherever the closest place is. Now, in deference; to Mr. 3o Charles's report,. there was a time listed for the pumper truck., Although I must say it's a little. 31 bit quicker than I: can :make it up than hill when I'm .driving safely, and I'm .not driving, 3z anything nearly that big. However, the report. does riot go on to complete the process and 33 that is the truck has to arrive on the scene;,, undo all of its hoses,,,get'its;.pump engines` fired, 34 up, hook up to the tank, and then.start dragging'tho"se hoses up slope before they're going to 3s do any good. Isn't that. right? Seems to me it ~s, The .report doesn't talk about how`far up 36 the alopes the hoses will reach and still `have an adequate pressure head. Or how long,-that 37 will take. But I can easily foresee a tree .crown. fire-making its way up, slope there beyond the 3s reach of the tankers and the hoses and all of that, because if we:have the kind of deadly day; 39 which I'm going. to address in just a moment,., that. occurred when the Oakland Hills went- up ao in flames, we will' have an unstoppable situation-there. The fact- that you say the .park is ai closed, I'm sorry, that's not good enough for me Mr: Charles; 'cause what that, means'is that az somebody's going to drive up; see the park is closed, and they're going to go on up further. 43 And: then they're going, to parkat orie of these, other places. So; you're right; the fire may .not as start at.Lafferty, but the chances of it starfing,on the mountain, nevertheless; are dramatically as increased. It's those conditions 'ladies sand gentlemen,.: that kind of.Santa .Ana wind .the dry a6 winds that'blow in from the Central, Valley: They don't .do it all. that often,. but they usually a~ come late 'in he year'before; the first. rains. One more comment on the, EIR You cite as one as of your major foundations for your .factual analysis; the experience of a fire'that occurred` up 49 there last year„ Well,,lV1r. Charles, I have totell you, I was there and I :didn't see: you there. so And your characterization is entirely inaccurate. First, you describe the conditions as dry and Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jdne. Hamilton, 1VR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH Mayor M. P, atricia Flilligoss, MS=Councilmember Mary Stompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-:Councilmember Pdmela Torliatt MM-Vice Mayor Matt.Maguire ~. . ;a~ August:24, :1998 Vo13 d. Page 217 i windy. If you had looked, you would have seen that it had already rained that year prior to z the fire, so that the bone dry conditions that would set off the whole mountain as a tinder 3 box, already didn't exist. Further, as I know, the fog line had come up and down the a mountain several times in the last several- .days, so things were far from tinder dry and s flammable.. Most of all, what you neglected to mention at all was the effort that the local 6 neighbors up there put on keeping that fire- from spreading. I got the call around two or three ~ in the morning, I don't know exactly when it was, and I was down there in maybe a little over s five minutes with a four by four, shovels, hose, rakes, and five large fire extinguishers. But 9 ,you know who. was there before I was even there? Peter Pfendler. And he had a spray rig on io the back of his giant four-wheel drive vehicle there, and he .and Lorin Morelli were keeping ii that fire edge from spreading on the whole downslope. When I pulled up, it was starting to iz get across the road and I didn't have much trouble keeping it from going across the road. 13 Mayor Hilligoss: Could you wind it up? is Randall Smith: Yeah, I'm sorry. You can see I'm [inaudible] to contribute a little bit is of this.. Last topic here. Fairfield/Osborne. I want to know more about Fairfield/Osborne. 16 It's close to me. It's a half mile away at the closest, or a quarter of a mile away the closest i~ from my place. Seems to me it's a perfect prototype fore exactly the kind of limited use park is that's being described here for Lafferty. I also believe it's been shut down because of the 19 incidence of vandalism and trespassing. I've got experience with those again, because I've zo come home to find people having picnics in my backyard, sitting in my hammock, swimming zi in my pond: I've been cursed out by them. My wife's been cursed out by them. For merely zz asking them to please respect the property _ boundary between my property and z3 Fairfield/Osborne. And it's not a pretty sight, ladies and .gentlemen. In conclusion, once za again, I want to hear what is so magical and divine about Lafferty that Moon doesn't offer if zs not in excess, while at the same time Lafferty gets preserved in accordance with Mr: Charles z6 number one priority of alternatives, and that is do nothing. Thank you. z~ ?? Madam Mayor, if I could, I want to clarify. It's my understanding the council zs wishes these comments to be .maintained at the three second as appropriate, or three minutes, z9 excuse me, three minutes. The City Clerk has been asked to keep the recording device. 3o Unless the council directs otherwise, I'm .going to ask her to keep the bell on after the three 31 minutes. Now, if the council wants to change that, we need clear direction in order to be fair 3z to the people that are trying to maintain their comments within the three minutes. So I'm 33 asking for clarification on this. 34 Vice Mayor Maguire: Madam Mayor, I think that's important, particularly if 3s the comments have been submitted to the record, as Mr: Randall's were, there was nothing 36 there that. I heard that was new for his written comments. So if you folks, if you submitted 37 the written comments, please don't take excess amount of time to reiterate what's already in 3s the record. 39 ??: So, I would ask the City Clerk not to turn off the bell, or if this is turned off, ao that within sixty seconds, turn it back on so in respect to those who are preparing their ai remarks in three minutes that they are equally honored as are the rest of the audience. az Councilman Keller: Madam Mayor? Could I just clarify something for Mr. Smith? a3 He asked us to respond on a series of questions. And I'd just like reiterate that our role here as at this point this evening is to be listening to testimony, not to engage in debate or some kind as of arguments over the merits of one policy or another. So just for your understanding, none a6 of the comments that are received here tonight are going to be responded to. They will be a~ responded to in the final EIR. Thank you. Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-Councilmember Mary Stompe DK- Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 218, Vol,, 32 August 24, 1998 i Mayor Hilligoss: Kim Nadeau? Is that right? z KN: Save your time. I`have nothing new. 3 Mayor Hilligoss: Okay. Janice :Caller=Thompson? a Janice Caller-Thompson: Good evening:: And I'll make mine very short. You s know; this is a model EIR process, and there's been plenty of input from the public: And .you 6 know,, it really 'go'es a long way to address the :concerns. of the people "that live on the Sonoma ~ Mountain. You know,. this .park will. be the most unimpacted park in, the State of California. s I mean, this ;process. has really just; you know; eliminated any possibilities except for, you 9 know, basically passive hiking. And that's fine with me: I .don't have. a ;problem with that. I io just hope that the council supports this EIR and goes .along -with the process. I think "it's i i important and I think I just want to make one comment. The reason Moon is not superior, or iz Lafferty is superior to Moon,, is because, the City of Petaluma :owns. Lafferty Ranch and we've 13 owned it since 1'959. .And; .you know, I'm sorry,. but the cost will depend. on Mr. Peter is Pfendler if he's going to continue the process .of fighting the city. And I really encourage you. is to support this EIlt, and I really encourage the people on the Sonoma Mountain.-not to 16 continue fighting and really recognize that this'park is extremely passive. And. you can. look. i~ at any other park in the State of California aril you're not going to find another one like this. is And so good luck. Thanks. i9 Mayor;Hilligoss: Will Stapp? zo Will Stapp: City Council Members, Madam Mayor. I just want to read a .couple zi portions of this.. My primary area of concern ;is with the section. of the EIR pertaining to the zz Sonoma Mountain. Road. I support alternative, one in which the .city works with the' county z3 to determine a road improvement 'plan for the road. However, I must emphasize that" the za county should bear primary responsibility for financing and conducting. any improvements. zs County Public Works has a longstanding documented understanding of the road's general z6 condition. and has considered upgrades in the ,,past. I have submitted this documentation to z~ Councilman Keller previously. I am disturbed that the County has required the city to assess' zs the road based, on ASHTO tandards. In my understanding, thisis' unprecedented and not in z9 the long term best interest of the county or "the taxpayers. It';s 1400 miles. of'road in Sonoma 3o County and many of them are rural county roads. Few of `the county country roads. meet 31 ASHTO. It would be fin ancially impossible for the County to hring them all up° to this' 3z exacting standard and even if the County could, bear such an excessive. financial. burden. such. 33 improvements .would. destroy the. character of many .of the roads widely used and greatly 3a cherished by our citizens. It could. also have .a chilling; effect on adiiitional public open space 3s and county parks in remote areas. With the .public demand fir recreational access to 36 undevelopment lands increasing, strict adherence' to ASHTO is poor public policy. F-inall}!; 37 while the .goal of safer roads is a' good one, as pointed. out recently by the Press Democrat, 3a better roads still can't stop the occasional unsafe driver. Quickly, I would dike to say that I 39 don't agree that all the road improvements should. be done 'before the park. opens. I think :it's ao better 'to conduct a study, open the park and then. fast track. to prioritize schedule for road ai improvement: And. I. think we need; to do that because. putting such a requirement. puts the az opening of the park at the mercy of county funding priorities; which are uncertain at best and 43 unfortunately; subject to the .convoluted politics we've seen .operating: against this project :at as the county level. I've submitted--Thomas--the other=-I have. a few comments' about responses as that were .already submitted, and one is to Thomas Lippy, who fur the Sonoma Mountain a6 conservancy, called ,for the city to develop a complete: management and ';monitoring, plan for a? the entire Adobe Creek:. While this .plan is beyond the scope of the city's jurisdiction. or as responsibility, I'm sure that the city is aware that the RCDC is working on such a plan and Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton;. NR-Councilmember 1Vancy Read' PH Mayor M: Patricia Hilligoss MS-Couizcilniember Mary Stompe DK Couneilmember David.Keller, PT Courrcilmember Pamela Torliatt MM--Vice Mayor Matt Maguire August 24, 1998 Vo1.3 Z, Page 219 i will .cooperate in .full: The city's .dedication of its water. rights certainly .indicates the best z intentions to preserve and enhance the vitality of Adobe Creek. John Samon, in item 13 of 3 his letter, dated July 15, T998, said that I' was the head of Citizens for Lafferty in a Regional a Park. While I make no bones about starting'the organization, .Bruce Hagen has been the s active chair person. for the last two years. ~Mr. Samon also indicated I was quoted -that. I 6 would trespass onto Lafferty whenever I wanted. Perhaps he had mistaken me for Hank ~ Flum, an elderly gentleman I would hardly describe as a revolutionary, who was caught in the e heat of the moment. by a reporter after the judge denied public once again their opportunity to 9 visit their own property. I have visited Lafferty twice to videotape for community access io television in the last six months. Both visits were recorded. with the Parks and Rec. While it ii is true that I said, the whole issues smacks of a class struggle, at the time it seemed an iz appropriate figure of speech to describe the public's wish to use their own property being 13 skewed by the agents of a secretive millionaire. Still, Mr. Samon's inaccurate rhetoric is swelling my statements to quote the encouragement of civil disobedience, and quote, class is warfare, disparage the great restraint and patience exhibited by our citizenry given the i6 reputed injury caused to this town during the underhanded attempt to privatize a.valuable i~ public watershed and block the creation of a long sought park. I would suggest that the is threats to security and peace of mind to which Mr. Samon alludes, live on the mountain, not 19 in the valley. Need I remind the council that Mr. Samon was by far the major listed zo contributor to the discredited committee of choice whose agents forged 2,000 signatures on zi election petitions and have pleaded guilty to felony counts of voter fraud. Should I point out zz that the most violent incident on Sonoma Mountain in recent history was Mr. Pfendler's z3 brutal assault. on his estranged wife? Or that Mr. Samon and Mr. Pfendler accosted a city za councilman who was inspecting city property. Lafferty Ranch was first mentioned as a park zs site in .the 1961 version of the Petaluma General. Plan. So when it comes to class, my hat is z6 off to the citizens of Petaluma for their tenacity and the realization of a 3 7-year dream. As to z~ the class of Mr. Samon, Mr. Pfendler and the alleged members of the secret of Sonoma zs Mountain Conservancy, who still refuse to identify themselves, I'd say it's sorely lacking. I z9 urge the ,council to ..endorse the. obvious public benefit of the proposed project. And I'm also 3o glad to see that .Mr. Smith has started °to say that he is actually a resident of Sonoma 31 Mountain Road. When we first heard from h1m, he gave his- just fifteen seconds and I'll be 3z done. When he first gave his address, he listed his business address and had the audacity to 33 say that he spoke for his 100 employees. Anyway, let's complete and adopt the EIR and 34 finally open up Laffertyto its public owners. Thank you. 3s Mayor Hilligoss: Robert Ramirez? 36 Robert Ramirez: Council Members. A couple of things I wanted to address 37 here, some comments tonight regarding: the Draft EIR. The first being the road hazards. I 3s spoke. before at -the planning commission regarding the ASHTO standards, and I won't .go s9 ..over that.. Obviously, it doesn't meet it,. nor: do only very few road, real roads, in the County ao of Sonoma. So I do. believe, though,, if-~-I've heard the :neighbors speak of the danger. up ai there: The`.extreme danger- and maybe it just"shouldd be closed. They should move them all az off the hill, you know, because I don't want nobody getting hurt up there, and definitely not 43 the residents of Sonoma Mountain Road. But that's obviously not going to happen. So the as point being that. I think David brought it up, that if we want to contribute any dollars at all, as it'll be a ownership share based on the property we own and maybe based on the amount of a6 land that people own up there. And potential uses out there, land actually can have, either a~ now or in the future, and maybe to the. actual uses they're generally using right now, be it as vineyard, be it agriculture uses, meaning the fact of how many employees that come up that 49 road every day, how many trucks are coming up that road? Those types of impacts could be Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-Councilmember Mary Stompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-Vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 220, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 i away to raise money if they wanted to .get involved in helping to ,pay for if: Otherwise, they z might want to get involved in just having- the county do it and keep. it simple. DefinifeIy; we 3 should not have it,a condition before opening the ,park $ased gn-the projected visitors; it's a not going to be enough to make that big of an `impact than: what's there now: I think the s citizens in the valley here can earn how to drive appropriately up the mountain: They don't 6 have any personal death wishes that I'm aware of. So I think'they can .getup to the park and ~ back. As to the wilderness: issue that was brought up here earlier;,1'vlr; Smith. is not aware of a this obviously, but wilderness is a Perm used,'in estate parks; in national parks,, they're: called 9 wilderness areas, and people are allowed to ~go. in and 'basically try to enjoy being: in the io wilderness. That's how they find out what wilderness is as opposed to what's an, urban urea i ~ or a developed area, or undeveloped area. They earn the difference. They also ,get to learn is about how to protect that environment. 'There was a good article in the paper that- the .Press 13 Democrat did about agricultural. being inconsistent with basically parks. Or inconsistent is basically with, trails,. which I didn't. quite, understand that one; and .Pat Cheda- was very is pronounced in tating that just wasn't consistent with.. trails,. -then where. do wee put; the trails? 16 Should we put them m industrial areas? Maybeit'd be consistent there: Should we put. them i~ in residential, neighborhoods? I mean, if it's not: consistent. out in the open space, then where is would-you want to put.. a trail? I woul.dlove to see an.altematve. Trespassing has been a big 19 concern. The EIR addressed it: The legal.. and approved method; foir trespassing is a ign that Zo says no trespassing. At this point; there's nothing much more beyond that. We cannot hire u guards with guns. to shoot people as they cross .the fence. That's just; not. w.hat's done: Okay. z2 The sign's been pretty much recognized icon that's been accepted '.and. used. and fairly well, z3 and worked fairly well.. over the years. You .always will have sorrAe bad apple: I think, the 2a majority of the: concern here,. unfortunately, is just an extreme .case of what we. call is nimbeeism. These .people. are consistently t .tying to put. us .down the hill on the Moon .Ranch, 26 because they know the value that .Lafferty Ranch has: They've owned it all, these- years: s~ without having to actually hold title. to it. They have controlled it. They have `basically za manipulated the use of it, and now we're aging we want to comer back, to our property, they z9 want to push us down the hill: I think--I hope you can,~see through that, that just their 30 .intention .of'wanting us :off that land tells you "right there that's `the, reason to keep it and why 31 it is the superior property. 32 Mayor Hilligoss: Patricia Tuttle:.Brown? 33 Patricia Tuttle-Brown: Well, the first thing 'I wanted to do is' to speak for ;the 34 person, there was a bicycle committee person, coming and he: must. have gotten delayed.. And 3s so for the record, I want to .reference the bicycle advisory committee -made comments on the 36 road, particularly with regard go the ASHTO standards that are=-X want to make, cure they 37 get into the record, because that's, the end is tonight. Right? Okay:. 'So you have that. Oh, 3a did get the record. Planning Department, .or:: Okay: So I wanf to make, my stand, my 39 comments: Oh, I didn't bring: my big--will'you ,hold it up, Nick? You. know, I've; become: the ao defacto hstorian;for'the Lafferty Ranch sort of`in brokely or'whatever that;word is. And this ai seems like--I've collected fourteen-=I've put. together fourteen hand"red. pages of this mess; a2 starting m--this is~.half of it, that's even hundred, starting in; you knew, with 1957, isn't when. a3 I started it at age b; but the 1~9--I mean; the 1959 purchase: And I=what I really want to say as tonight is I .sat there_today, Lhad==T managed to_get two. and a;half hours of child care: for my as daughter. She wasn't born. when this started'.. She.had her;fifth, birthday°yesterday. And, -you 46 know, some friends of my parents wanted to watch her, so I had two aril a half hours and I a~ started .reading through. I got that much.:read. And I ;guess: what:I want to say tonight :is that 49 so in a sensertit's almost~likespeaking-lju thht's important fo speak the truthlvIts not gket~ I Key to abbreviations: JH=Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. Patricia.Hilligoss, MSCou~:cilmemberll%IarySlompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-'vice Mayor Matt Maguir, e 4~ _ , August 24,,1998 ~ Vo1.3~, Page 221 i think you, don't..'know this. But I-feel that all of-what's been ..happened before is a means of z keeping people; us, people; not the. people that live there, but us people off of Lafferty 3 Ranch, us people down here. And I feel like there have been a serves of means by which a that's been tried and looking through the seven hundred pages I reviewed mildly today, you s know, there have been a couple of different ways. The first way was, of course, 1989,. Peter s Pfendler appraised the property and wanted to buy it. It might not have been made public at ~ that point, but there was the appraisal. I have. all these things, I have all these papers that, it's s the paper trail. Okay. Buying ~t .didn't work. Okay. So that was about 6/4/92 when it was 9 like no, we want to keep this, That was when Michael Davis was pro, pro going on Lafferty. io So then in 9/4/92, was when Mr. Pfendler spearheaded the lawyer's correspondence multiple ri pages, it's too dangerous, the .golden eagles are there, the steelhead are there. That was that iz attempt. Let's keep people off by saying it's too .dangerous. Then in TO/15/92, this is reams 13 of pages here, then it went from the local level to the county level. That was when the is proposal by the Sonoma Mountain Landowners Association, this is the one that nobody is seems to know is in, but there's three of them, request for deletion of the park designation i6 from the county general plan. This was said in a letter by county, it's very hard for me after i~ Randy Smith to feel like I shouldn't be able to finish my speech, I have to admit. The general- is -the county staff actually wrote about this general plan application filed by the Sonoma 19 Mountain Property Owners Association that it was contrary to written county policy zo regulation for a general plan application .to not be initiated by the property owner. This was zi absolutely shocking. The City of Petaluma didn't find out about it until later, and still the zz language in the county general plan, as we all know, if we've read this, you know, still the z3 county language ended up changed as a result of this. Changed to say limited access, za educational field trips. They didn't get program 23 out of there, which said Lafferty Ranch zs potential. park. But that sort of didn't quite work. So then it was okay, the trade idea came z6 up. All with the intent of keeping us off the land. The trade idea came up. As we all know, z~ the council had this courageous decision, which you all were part of, of let's not do the trade. zs That didn't work. Okay. Well, the ballot and ballot measure, potential ballot measure and z9 the forged signatures, that was passed for our review today, but that was kind of the next 3o way of well, hey, you know, let's put it on the ballot, we have to pay people to walk around 31 town and get the signatures and then there were forgeries, it was really... Okay. So where 3z are we today? So we've got--now, we're at the. EIR. So I simply see it, the opponents to the 33 EIR, it's like old home week, it is the same arguments. And the ideal of the EIR here is, " 3a okay, let's price the road out of sight. I mean, that is the basic theme by which the opponents 3s would like "to see this squashed, quashed, I guess the term is. Okay? And so, what I urge 36 you to do is not not let yourself be scared by that. I mean, if you go through the EIR are at 37 stake, that the county, for some bizarre reason, insisted on ASI-ITO standards. ASHTO 3s standards are not the .norm all over the county or for wilderness parks. Why did that get. in 39 there? Who the heck knows? Maybe the same reason why the Sonoma County--Sonoma ao Mountain Landowners Association got to finagling with the general plan behind backs. It's ai not really necessary for parks to have the roads to be at ASHTO standards, so let's not get az scared Doff by that. And what I want to say is that it's--you know, I hope it ends here. But a3 there is, you know, we don't have the money, that's part of what the taxpayers association's as upset about. You know, we as citizens, we don't have the money, but there is the money up as there on "the mountain. How long will they keep this going? Because if you all accept the a6 EIR, the next thing. is to go to the courts. So it goes from a local level, the county level to a~ the state level. Maybe the federal level. I wish that the war would stop, because it's the same as issue that it started out with. And there was a letter at the very beginning of this in '92 by 49 Gary Anderson. And I just want to finish the rest of the letter, I mean the end of the letter, so which said, "you know, it could have been written today. And it was 9/24/92. It said the Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatrieiaHilligoss, MS-Councilmember MaryStompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM I~iceMayorMattMaguire Page 222, Vol. -32 August 24, 1998 i opponents of this are convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt: that any public access even as z few as eight people; which is what the original access plan was talking about. Eight'people a 3 day. To Lafferty Ranch will bring utter destruction and an end, to .an exclusive enjoyment of a this special world above the rest of'us. Geographically, of course. 'Chat litter would inundate s the roads, fire would engulf the. `land, .death and, destruction. of the wildlife and environment 6 would quickly follow. People need space. This :is all Gary Andersen. You know, this is like ~ six years. ago.. People need. space. and access to open; space for which they can escape to clear s their minds, lift their .spirits, broaden their perspective; above everyday problems. Such. 9 places are precisely what Petaluma:. needs.. And' ;a final decision shc-uld take into account the io need of the citizens and the taxpayers, not just a .privileged' few who want 'to wrap.. up the ri property for themselves. So, I feel,like--you :know, stay with it ,and I hope that the deep iz pockets on the other end stop so that we could actually go back fa what we could .have had 13 m, ,you know, 9/7/92, was the original draft, .Lafferty Draft Access -Plan, and Ghat wasn't is thousands of dollars... Okay. Thank you. is Mayor Hllgoss: Thank you. Any liaison reports? i6 Vice Mayor Maguire: Madam Mayor? i~ Mayor Hilligoss: Yes. is Vice.Mayor Maguire: Before we rush onto the next: subject, if there's nobody else to i9 speak in the. public; I do-have a question for staff. zo Mayor Hilligoss: Okay. zi Councilwoman Torliatt: Does anyone elsewant to speak, or...? zz Vice Mayor Maguire: Anybody else like to speak? Sir? z3 Alan Bush: Yeah, I'd like. to speak. za Vice Mayor Maguire: Would you come forward and state your name and 'address for zs the record, :please? z6 .Alan Bush: Good evening, everyone: 1VIy name is Alan: hush, I've .moved. into:. this. z~ area with my wife about a,.few months ago. I've no 'idea what all this is about. You all seem zs so emotional. And everybody's getting, ;onto the emotional scene. Wow! What a trip this. z9 place is, It's a .soap opera already:; I come from; L:A...And. I don't know half the neighbors. 3o Already I got the city council here: It's amazing. ,I don't .really care whether there's a park 31 there or .not. I don't know: I ,only know that that road is very narrow. I .know .I'm having.. 3z trouble just getting. to my property right, now. People. come up there and park;. There's 33 already--since I've been there in; the last couple- of months, there's alreadygang ,graffiti on the 34 signs out there. Already spray painted on the road.. There is signs been pulled .down. There's 3s garbage .already .dumped. A'huge, truckload of garbage was stopped. on the side ofthe road 36 halfway up'the mountain. And ever since :it's been ,publicized in the newspaper, it's already 3r brought attention. and more people up there, already they're making their mark. So it's a 3s strange event: I mean; the road: is impossible.. It's hard just'to get a car up there know.- You. 39 got to stop, let the other one come forward. How do you .expect F;ven four more cars tq go ao up? I don't understand why that hasn't been. taken into account. You've got; to double that. ai size of the road just. to get up and down in. a natural way:. That's' all I can say,. sand excuse my az ignorance; but I've;been here.ten'minutes:in comparison:to everybody else.. But I'm enjoying a3 it from what I've seen of it. and I love Petaluma.,, That's why I'm here:. I moved. away from as L.A. because I felt this was an ideal place to settle- and enjoy: And as far as I'm concerned it as still is. Okay? So I hope you understand. To me, it'sa little strange to put a park n.a corner Key to abbreviations: JH-CouncilmemberJane Hamilton, NR-Counclmember,NancyRead PH Mayor M. Patxicia:Hilligoss; MS CouncilmemberMdryStompe DK- Councilmember Dauid.Keller, PT-Couracilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-Tice Mayor Matt Maguire August 24, 1998 Vo1.3~. Page 223 i where it's the most difficult place to get to up and down that road. It really is. And if you z haven't been there, and you're just listening~to all this, I think the best thing is you go up there 3 because you probably got. more common sense than everybody else sitting there. So just go a out and have a look yourself. Thank you. s Vice Mayor Maguire: Madam Mayor? 6 Mayor Hilligoss: Yes. ~ Vice Mayor Maguire: Thank you. If the .gentleman thinks this is emotional, he really s missed. 9 Mayor Hilligoss: That's how close... io Councilwoman Torliatt: He really did miss. ii Vice Mayor Maguire: He's missed out on the real fun. iz Councilwoman Torliatt: You should see. Is there anyone else, Madam Mayor, 13 that wanted to speak? is Vice Mayor Maguire: I think that was the last one. is Mayor Hilligoss: I think that's it. i6 Vice Mayor Maguire: Close the public hearing. Madam Mayor, just a process i~ question, some of the questions that were posed tonight are--particularly I'm thinking of a is number of the questions from the Sonoma County Taxpayers Association are really, if they 19 have been answered, some of them have been previously answered by letter, I know, because zo I specifically asked staff, you know, a year or so to do that and I know some of those have zi been answered. A number of the questions are not really germane to the EIR, and some are zz actually impossible to answer, you know, they're sort of speculation type questions, so as a z3 process question, maybe Leonard, you can respond to this, or Pamela, you can, how do we za deal with questions that are really not germane? Do we just note them and say this is not zs germane to the EIR process? z6 Planning Director Tuft: Thank you, Tom. You just answered it yourself. We z~ note them, that they are--thhat :they've been mentioned and we attempt to answer them. If zs they are germane to the EIR, we address them in all detail as possible, and if they're not we'll z9 note that rt's not relative to the environmental analysis. 3o Vice Mayor Maguire: Great. Thank you, Pamela. 31 ??: Mayor and Vice Mayor, there are some of those questions that perhaps are 3z not germane to the EIR which staff will report on, but--and I sense generally what some of 33 those are, but that we do have other information on that reports have been prepared and have 3a been brought current on many of the budgetary issues, the cost of operation and maintenance, 3s etc., etc.,. so ,the council have seen at least two reports on those issues since. I've been here s6 .and there are others now that we're reviewing to bring those most current to be sure they're 37 comprehensive. So as some of that is already available, we'll be sure. i't's provided. 3s Vice Mayor Maguire: Thank you. 39 Councilwoman Torliatt: Madam Mayor? ao Mayor Hilligoss: Yes. ai Councilwoman Torliatt: I just wanted to thank the folks that came tonight to az give their input. Once again, it has been a very, very.long time, probably more than 30 years, Key to abbreviations: JH-Councilmember Jane Hamilton, NR-Councilmember Nancy Read PH-Mayor M. PatriciaHilligoss, MS-Councilmember MaryStompe DK Councilmember David Keller, PT-Councilmember Pamela Torliatt MM-vice Mayor Matt Maguire Page 224, Vol. 32 August 24, 1998 1 and it's been talked about for forever... S"o in,response to some of the questions, I hope we are -- s ~ nearer to a .solution and Ibelieve- we're nearer to a solution to this question. So th__ank you 3 again for coming. a Mayor giilligoss: Any other questions you want answered? No? Then liaison s reports. Okay. And we .have. all the information from the City Manager. And so then. I will s adjourn the .meeting to September 1st,: 7 Councilwoman Stompe: No, meeting next Monday. s Councilwoman Torliatt: The 31st, August 3'1 st at Lucchesi, for PCDC. 9 Vice Mayor Maguire: A good reminder, a meeting next.:Monday, a special meeting on to the redevelopment strategy report at Lucchesi Community Center, 7 o'clock, the regular rl meeting. li AD~O-U1[~T 13 At 8:45 p.m. the meeting was adjourned to August 31. 14 15 16 17 1g .. 1vI. Patricia` lligoss, `P~Iayor 19 ATTEST: zo 21 22 ~ Patricia E. Bernard, City Clerk Key to abbreviatio»s: JH-Cou»cilmember Ja»e-Hamilton, IVR-Cou»cilmember Na»cyRead PH-Mayor M. Patricia Hilligoss, MS-CouneilmemberMary Stompe DK Couneilmember David Keller,. PT-Couneilmember Pamela Torliatt Nf1Gt I~iee A%fayor Matt Maguire